Due in large part to the actions of public health professionals it didn't blow up into a larger pandemic.

You're welcome.

SaintGeorge

Ah Swine Flu part deux. How did that epidemic pan out?

Is your mind really so defective that you think this is the same thing?

A cinderella story of greed and profit!

Sounds like the oil industry. Or was it the housing industry? Maybe the banking industry?

Oh wait I meant the republican and democrat political parties!~

Ah yes...early August and right on time for our annual "we're all gonna die" pandemic/epidemic scare. But this one is different!! Not a virus, but a bacteria. Hmmmm, how do you vaccinate against a bacteria? You don't. So how is big pharma gonna make money on this latest crisis??

a mismatch between the scientific difficulty of finding treatments and the MODEST SALES such products are likely to generate.

Guess John Q is @!$%# outta luck on this one. Moral of the story: have your surgeries in the good ole U.S. of A.

Anthony,

Quite frankly you have no idea what you are talking about.

Anthony--What in the world do you mean? Where do the "greed and profit" parts come in?

Not a--Why don't you vaccinate against a bacterium?

Sounds like a good reason to discourage the movement of people about the globe or it will accelerate the spread of this bacterial mutation. As good a reason as any to totally stop country to country immigration, whether that immigration is legal or illegal.

Joe,

I agree with you and send my thanks along. The combined effort of the medical establishment and mass communications gave an excellent force to help keep that mess under control. Informed , not hysterical communications is key in any mass incident to combat fear and panic. Hope this pattern holds true for any future epidemics.

St George, what level of probabiliy of severe impact you think we should set before we worry about the spread ? Got any science in your background.....how's that working out ?

Just saying, second guessing is easy, being involved in a risk based global decision without the benefit of hindsight is ... pretty tough.

Not a--Why don't you vaccinate against a bacterium?

Vaccinations/innoculations are for viruses only (polio, herpes, flu, rabies, etc.) and involve injecting the actual dead virus into the body to build up immunity. They are given PROACTIVELY and are ineffective against bacteria, which require an antibiotic. Antibiotics are given REACTIVELY once the bacteria cause infection and antibiotics are useless against viruses.

Couldn't we all just inject some of BP's "dispersants?'

They seem to kill everything.

I'm more concerned about the scientists that are creating these super-bugs. The thing is people, our government will create a virus for people to catch and die when the timing is right.

Population control! Feed a certain group of people (blacks, elderly, disabled, & gays) free food and koolaid. The Jim Jones Project!

This is where we are headed people. Our government is already producing foods, bottled water to make people sterile, and this is just the beginning.

We really need to be concerned on what scientists are creating, and why America feels the need to have China to create flu vaccines for the people of America. I stay away from those vaccines. China has already been exposed for sending poisonous products to America, so why take a chance on medication and vaccines coming from China.

god, it's the same in that this smells like another media induced panic in the making, and if anyone in washington owns stock in a pharm that has a vaccine, count on more of this bull.

Chunky-Monkey, are you for real? Please, start taking your medicine. I am sure they are giving you something for your paranoid delusions. Just a thought....

Wow, Chunky Monkey,

I'm cynical, but you're just crazy.

Chunky-Monkey, are you for real? Please, start taking your medicine. I am sure they are giving you something for your paranoid delusions. Just a thought....

As shocking as it sounds, there absolutely HAVE been discussions held by organizations like the Council on Foreign Relations on how to reduce the population of the Earth using sterilants in water sources and in certain "staple foods" depending on region.

This is part of the greater overall plan to dissolve the sovereignty of the U.S. and merge into a socialistic, totalitarian one-world-government. Every modern president has been a part of it. Every major global economy is part of it. If this scares the hell out of you, then you understand it correctly.

If you don't believe it, look up Youtube interviews with Henry Kissinger about the "New World Order" for starters. It gets deeper, and deeper from there.

Wait....when did vaccines become limited to only viruses??? Ever heard of vaccines against BACTERIAL illnesses such as pertussis, pneumococcus, tetanus, diptheria, meningococcus????

And the ONLY vaccines that involve live attenuated viruses (weakened) are measles, mumps, rubella and chickenpox.....

Joe is right. Education went a long ways into preventing Swine Flu from being worse than it was.

Education does play a role in this.

Chunky-Monkey thank you for your in sight, poplulation control shouldn't be laugh at or dismissed. Solent Green the movie, i could see the day when american's would be living like those in the movie-as the earth continue to warm and water stock's around the earth like snow cap montains continue to get less and less snow the water will start to vanish.As will the rich farm land vanish without water-Poluting the oceans isn't helping Human's ether-The air we breathe isn't healthy because of what our nation and other nation's leadership are allowing to be put in our air. China has tried to control their population and the India population is growing-Africa is the new fronteer for the new world order i think,Arms sell and famine!Aides and lack of services for the people in Africa under their control.Population control y/n-Aren't their war's continuing around this planet? and what countries or nation's are profitting from the sell of their weapon's to 3rd world nations? Population control is even used here in America-One Race of people here in this nation died before any other,The goverment of this nation keep's the numbers of american citizen who die and what they died of,Who was Living in poverty or not when they died the IRS would know-Owned a home when they died the IRS would know-People who are Americans are treated as second class citizens right here in good old America.1968 how many black american's lived here? Today what are their numbers? As many unwed mother's having babies in the Black community, why the slow growth of a people?

Every little forum here eventually turns to either bashing the Dems or bashing the Republicans. Who are you people? How is it that a relatively great part of your daily pleasure comes from either bragging about or denigrating some DC hack? If you gave it thought, you'd realize that there is no real difference between any of them; they are like baseball players or movie actors; they contend for a lucrative, cushy life and then do anything up to murder to keep it. Lately, due to the sucker partisan voters, these pols establish so-called dynasties. They get their wife, kid, cousin or brother elected and keep the cash in the house.

America has a broken system. We have to fix it.

If (and it is a big if) governments are trying to kill off people. Why don't people try to take control of their own health, food and water instead of relying on the government. This is what I am trying to say. I have better things to do, then worry about the government trying to kill me. Be knowledgeable about yourself, what you do to your body and what you put in your body. Then you don't have to watch your back everyday to see if someone is following you, waiting to slip something in your food.

Well, this is it, the end, we're all going to die, (eventually)...

You people that spout government conspiracy really have to think things through. Yes, governments have taken steps to curb population growth, like China with the one baby rule. This was not some underhanded conspiracy, it was an open policy. The US is a different story. Population growth is very low, at least compared to some countries. reducing populatoions at this point would assure the demise of the country. We already have trouble keepin the military completely staffed and in essence every American born represents incomming tax revenue. Nobody is trying to kill youy off however, in some cases you may be able to argue that some are more concerned with the more immediate economic effects that modified foods provide rather than any health benefits. So a lot of people just may not care.

To thoise that think that these warning are just a ploy to create a panic market, there is probably some truth to that. Pandemics are far more common than we tend to think about. Up until the mid twentieth century, "small" pandemics were killing millions. The Spanish flu of 1819 killed almost 700,000 Americans and an estimate 8 million worldwide. A "bug" that wipes out a significant number of people is far more likely than an asteroid killing us off, or some other natural threat.

Not a Socialist in post #1.4 says: "Hmmmm, how do you vaccinate against a bacteria? You don't."

There are in fact vaccines for some bacterial infections. A vaccine exists for cholera and bubonic plague for example.

We outsourse our jobs to india and they outsourse this crap to us.

I'm just going to throw this out there: Those of us who have been vaccinated as children likely got the DTP vaccine. It is against diptheria, tetanus, and pertussis. ALL of those diseases are from bacteria. You can totally vaccinate against a bacterium, we just don't vaccinate against ones that are easily treated by antibiotics and have minimal long lasting impact.

Oh, and the reason antibiotics don't work on viruses is because antibiotics are made for bactieria...antivirals are made for visuses. If I need to explain that more, we have other issues.

Ugly American

Chunky-Monkey thank you for your in sight

You are welcome. Some people don't like hearing the truth, and when they do, they are ready to strike at you and put you down.

Most people don't even understand or studied the People vs Goverment in the film Miss Evers Boys, where our own government knew these people were sick with syphilis and had a cure for them, yet they failed to give them the medicines to help them, but instead wanted to use all these black men and families as guinea pigs in their experiments.

http://www.npr.org/programs/morning/features/2002/jul/tuskegee/ <<< story

Our government is no better than Saddam Husein killing his own people. The USA is known for doing this time after time, and the Aids Virus I strongly believe was put out into the public to try and kill all the gay men, blacks and poor people.

Anytime our government claims to be helping you, you better start looking for the motive behind it. Nothing comes for free, and it may end up costing you everything, even your life.

Chunky Monkey - it's become a failure of the people to know anything other than what Big Brother tells us. Ultimately we are hurting ourselves.

We have started a new group called Elitists and Big Brother Watch if you are interested.

I didnt think i needed to revisit this but I guess people like Don and How1 demand it.

It was a cinderella story of greed when you look at how super corporations push the use of antibiotics in cases where they arent warranted. Your handsoap has antibiotics in it.

Not children todays lesson is about bacteria. Bacteria lives in the swampy area along rivers, creeks, and water run off areas from development. When you introduce large amounts of antibiotics into your environment(In dangerous proportions for nothing more than profit), the bacteria in your environment becomes immune to the anti-biotics.

Vishnu forbid(sorry for the joke on religion)that the worst case scenario were to occur where some super bug kills off 95% of the world population. People like Don seem to want this to happen as validation of the repercussions of greed.

Corporate greed you tool.

the fact that a majority of people believe like Don makes me sad for the future.

LOL

Are you saying then, that it will never happen?

no wonder why most places in the world dislike americans--we can't even think of one good thing to say about ourselves, why should they do the same? even on informative articles, there has to be someone to bring up faults which really do not have any relevance to the article itself. tell me, what good things do you say about this country?

Who is denying science in this case?

Oh c'mon Castle...

you know it's only a matter of time before some religious nut case will say that any new super bug is Gods way of eraticating or punishing some group on the face of the earth....that is't all in "His plan"...LOL

hey jackazz boston ,, god dont punish!!!!!!!!!! we punish ourselves!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

God doesn't need to punish us! We are destroying ourselves just fine! ; )

boston, you mean that same science that said the bird flu was going to wipe life off the face of the planet?

cmon, science said it could and the world reacted accordingly.There have been several times since 1918 when a global pandemic was in process and it was stopped dead in its tracks. That's because public health officials warned us and we reacted.

It would be polite of you to thank those of us who headed the warnings.

southernbutnotstupid

Here in the US, we won't worry about it - kinda like global warming; just deny the science and everything will be fine--

I would change your screen name. Replace but not with and completely.

When it comes to this year's horror, be it climate, germs, whatever, just follow the money, folks! Who gains?

joe's not full of himself at all!

Hmm, historic floods in Pakistan, mammoth forest fires in Russia, the warmest American summer on record?

Nope, all seems pretty normal, nothing to worry about here.

You people keep telling liberals that God hates them for our immorality. Make up your mind.

To Joe

Just another piece of the end times puzzle. Just watched some shows on the science channel, they say that animal attacks have increased a hundred fold in the last twenty years, that species that normally do not attack humans are becoming more aggressive. There was a man cutting wood with a chain saw when a cougar started watching him.

He said that he revved up the chain saw to scare it away but it did no good, after about 5 minutes of watching him it attacked. He cut it with the chain saw and it ran away and was later hunted down and killed, but the park rangers said they had never seen that behavior from a cougar before.

Could it be that the animals (Gia) know that something is coming down and that we are the cause of it and (Gia) has declared war on us?

Hey Ray Cote......

god didn't create man....MAN created god.

dummy

What I find strange.....nowhere in this story did the author mention any real specifics about this "super bug"...i.e...has it killed people?...what are the symptoms for those who have it?...are those who have it being quarantined?...can it be controlled by 'simple' handwashing?..etc.

So many unanswered questions and yet look how easily we can throw around that 'pandemic' word.

I'd take it much more seriously if this type of thing didn't happen every. single. year. Every August or so there's a new drug-resistant superbug originating in some country with poor health conditions, and it's going to wipe out 10- 20 percent of the population. Come April or so of next year we'll be hearing the obligatory comments of 'we lucked out, it wasn't as bad as we thought it was going to be'. I get it, I get it. Wash my hands, cover my mouth when coughing, stay home when sick. I've still got masks and gloves from the avian flu, I think I'm set.

My thoughts exactly.

The only problem farmer with this type of thinking is YOU are going to be the one to die off ( and your children) I don't like this anymore than you do. I want everyone to live well, be highly educated, have clean water, good food and basic health care. BUT the sad fact is in times of "pestilence" it is the wealthy that generally do better. You can quote biblical passages until the cows come home but it doesn't change the fact that socially and economically disadvantaged people die of disease at much greater rates than the rich ( including obesity)

I have friends that work at the CDC and they are doing their best to protect the public, they are mothers/sisters and wives. I am really proud of the work they are doing.

During the Plauge! The Disease did not discriminate on wealth!

Although in today's world, if a cure is found you can bet Wealth will Procure it faster!

nature is always last at bat.....

Considering India,,,I think this would be a great place to start thinning the thunderous herd..

om goodness, what do you have against India?

We need to thin the herd. The Armagendom gang is in need of a good thinning!

What a minute, I thought the four horsemen were lawyers, government bureaucrats, politicians, and progressives!!! Of course if we put these four categories in charge of developing a way to fight this mutant bacteria, then they morph into Pestilence!!!

Get your pikes, boys! To the castle!

Chris s.

Actually even during the Plague the wealthy could move to areas without infection and some did. Those that stay behinfd oftentimes succumbed to the disease. Many retreated to estates in the countryside which were a bit better off than those living in more densley populated areas.

In my view, beeter to be rich, especially in today's world.

Seriously? This isn't a plague, it's a troubling but relatively isolated development. If we're aware of it and react intelligently there's no reason for it to continue to spread.

Obviously this is not the plague, I have not seen one flagellate roaming the countryside. OOPs wait I hear the call of the death carts, "Bring Out your dead."

you people crack me up with your paranoia and biblical quotes. Hello?...we live in 2010 not 1510. We have what is called mass communications, emergency planning, community outreach, dissemination of information and most of all.....MEDICINE! Not all viruses and bacterias will cause a plague....calm down and don't cause panic where there is none.

Those who allow panic, misinformation and fear to control your actions will not make good choices in their health care. Use your common sense and listen to health officials instead of bible quotes....

not even close...

If you don't know what you're talking about, please don't speak. I love the internet but sometimes I think making misinformed, ignorant statements on message boards should be more embarrassing.

what are you even talking about? pick up a chemistry book and read before you speak..you sound stupid.

Oh, I'm sorry. Let me just go sit in the corner with my dunce hat on. Maybe you should explain what the hell I'm trying to say because obviously everyone of you is a peer-reviewed PhD with years of experience in microbiology and knows what you're talking about.

Picking on someone without any real substance? Really? How low can we go? Back up your criticism of my statements with something next time and I'll take you a little more seriously.

vaccines don't work against bacterial infections - they work against viruses. we use antibiotics against bacterial infections.

science, much?

#@!

Uh, yes they do Hugo. Typhoid anyone? Whooping cough. There are vaccines against bacterial infections.

Here's the second part of the conversation-

There's no money to made, so the drug companies won't help us on these. It's like snake antivenons and flu vaccines... no money in it- cya good luck and aloooohaaaa

Guess they only make good drugs

hey sober one,,, get a clue.. what the hell are u talking about???

Bacteria don't need viruses to transfer pieces of DNA; they actually pick up frgaments lying around in the environment, often left over from dead bacteria, and absorb them. So even if the immune system kills all resistant bacteria, new, non-resistant bacteria can come in and absorb the pieces of the dead bacteria's DNA and become resistant.

What I don't understand is why we still use antibiotics at all. Our genetic engineering capabilities are at the point now that we could be manufacturing bacteriaphages: viruses that attack bacteria. There's no risk of the virus mutating and infecting humans; jumping onto other bacteria, sure, but the jump from bacteria to human cells is pretty huge. It would be far harder for bacteria to become resistant to a virus than a chemical poison.

you can't seriously be suggesting that "there's No risk of the virus mutating and infecting humans" So I haven't taken virology in about ten years but even I know that is a far out statement. Anyway, did you hear they are trying out your idea on our meat now. Viruses that kill bacteria on meat but are supposed to be benign in humans. Interesting, but I think I will pass.

The problem with using phage to combat pathogenic bacteria is largely due to allergic shock. An antibiotic is generally only a single molecule that can be screen for allergic potential. Any peptide produced by a phage could potentially become an allergen. Considering even a simple phage is composed of dozens of peptides, the number of potential allergic reactions is crazy. It might be possible to engineer a phage that our gut bacterial already carry. However, even if it doesnt elicit a response in the GI tract, putting it into the blood stream could change that.

I'm an Information Technology expert, in the health care field........now I know what people must be thinking when listening to a discussion between me and my peers......."what the @#$k are they talking about?" This is how I feel as I read this thread; but it does sound like y'all know what you're talking about.

It's been a long time since I studied life sciences in college, and your dialog reminded me of this, I plan to do some current research on the matter.........thanks.

The human body only survives via a symbiotic relationship we share with the bacteria in our gut. If the bacteriophage you suggest were to get loose or "accidentally" kill off all that bacteria, you wouldn't be able to digest your food properly. Without medical care, you could even die from the resulting dehydration, diarrhea, malabsorption, and starvation.

There is no way to tell the organism to attack the bacteria in of part of the body and not the other or to stop at a certain number to preserve the balance point that your body needs. There's no way if it gets free to stop it from mutating.

As far as the natural selection goes, it does seem to be taking more of a hold in areas with hygiene issues and high populations as would be expected. This world can support an agrarian society of maybe 1.5 billion people at most. This world currently holds over 8.5 billion people, most of which are in places like Africa, India, and China. It's any wonder there are people starving and living in poverty. The world is not an infinite resource and we should stop treating it like it is.

no money in it

these guys are'nt non-profit

We as a people are so screwed up a thinning of the herd is just what we need. Bring it!

Captain Trips to the rescue

1% of 6 billion is... 60 million?

Ah Captain Trips, have not heard that name in a while, though if Captain Trips mates with the bird flu we might have to promote him to General Trips.

The was a lab in Australia that mated Hanta to a cold virus 10 years ago- if it had got-out, it would have killed us all.

Somebody's very likely to do the same thing with this in a lab

General Tripps, indeed

To Don Smith

Oh Ok I was references the Captain Tripps featured in Stephen Kings novel (The Stand) it was the super flu that brought about the end of civilization as we know it.

it was...

just a typo for the end of the world

Agree with what you said. I had to go to the emergency room doubled over in pain a couple of months ago and my Insurance says they are only going to cover $500 and I would have to pick up the rest. I got my bill for $7500.00 for 3 hours in the ER for them to prescribe some pain medicine! What a crock. I feel like they want me to pick up the tab for everyone else that was in the ER.

Pumpkin...

you nailed it right on the head with the unregulated facilities issue. That's the key to receive any good product. Unfortuantly it does come with a higher price tag of which many can't afford or we complain about. We are our own worst enemies sometimes here in the U.S. as we complain about all the bureaucracy and high unrealistic cost standards, but those standards keep a check and balances which in turn give us a good quality control.

Too bad we have greedy shareholders and banks that want our money before our health.

Pumpkin, I agree with most of what you state. There is however one exception. Global warming is very real. It has not been blown out of proportion and there is no REAL evidence that it has been.

These people are going overseas for elective cosmetic surgeries. I, personally, don't think my taxes should have to pay for some bimbo to get huge breasts or a nose job. I also think they should have to have a blood test and full exam at the American boarder by a doctor before being allowed back in our country after they indulge in that kind of stupidity.

To put it in perspective, if I were to buy a healthy puppy from overseas, it would have to have full exams by certified vets both before and after transport, as well as spend 2+ weeks in a kennel for observation before release. Dog viruses/illnesses are not communicable to humans. So, why is it that humans who come back from these places are allowed to pass freely without exams?

jchayward44-1 is right, btw. Global Warming has been downplayed, if anything. We're seeing new cloud formations never before recorded, stronger storms, we're loosing a yard of beach a year to rising seas, temperature averages up by 2F for Summer last year and 10F over normal on average here for Summer this year. We're already seeing baseball sized hail, unseasonable weather, drought like conditions followed by torrential downpours that resemble being parked under a waterfall, and more. These are all things every one of us can SEE for ourselves and are experiencing. They aren't theory, they are facts that have and are still happening. We can't avoid it anymore. It's here. At this point it's more about damage control and surviving it.

soberone - you probably are picking up the tab for others. illegals, uninsured, homeless etc. Better read over the bill really well and ask for explanations. You know, "why did you list an MRI, CT scan and xray?'

I'm in Southern California, and our weather has actually been milder than usual the last 2 years, so no, I haven't personally seen any of the effects you speak of. I do agree that storms are stronger recently, but my point was that the planet goes through natural fluctations as well and since we've only been recording actual weather data for less than 100 years, there are many people (myself included) who believe that the cause of the recent changes in environment can't be conclusively linked to human activity - at least not entirely. I fully support activity to make the planet healthier and cleaner, but I supported this prior to climate change hitting the news, also.

Bobinfla, If you're more concerned with breasts than survival, then I would like to introduce you to my freind Charles Darwin. He had something to tell you about survival of the fittest.

American: "Better read over the bill really well and ask for explanations. You know, "why did you list an MRI, CT scan and xray?'"

How right you are. Am in the medical field and mistakes (and occasionally intentional overbilling) happen all the time. Stories like the man who was billed for a pap test or the woman billed for a prostate exam are sadly common. Everyone should check their bills, even those whose insurance is picking up the tab. My own mom was billed for daily physical therapy when the incompetent boob of a PT only entered her room twice in 2 weeks, and then only to ask if she was exercising. Got M'care to refuse payment for that.

The poetic justice of 1st world citizens, who have made childish selfishness and consumer ignorance some of the cornerstones of their economy, being infected by the actions of some of the most selfish and ignorant of their own people- people who would go to a 3rd world country for elective cosmetic surgery, for the love of Mike- is breathtaking. You just couldn't write dark comedy this apt or humorous. Western civilization brought low by hindu boob and nose jobs. This is good stuff, Hollywood. You like making end-of-the-world disaster pictures? Try this for a title- "Killer Rhinoplasty: the Revenge of Shiva". LMFAO.

To Kevin

I'd go watch it LOL

Well stated.

Sometimes the voice of reason can be pretty lonely, n'est pas?

C'est vrai! Merci.

that research is mostly (in some cases, almost entirely) funded with federal dollars, yet the pharmaceutical companies take all of the reward.

#@!

You hit the nail directly on the head, Another Voice. Thank you for your post. I have worked in "biotech/big pharma" for many years and I can tell you that the scientists that work on these problems every day do not make as much as most people think. They are dedicated, hard-working people who are EXPECTED to burn the midnight oil just as you have described.

You show me your data and I'll show you mine...

http://www.princeton.edu/~ota/disk1/1993/9336/933611.PDF

Yes, federal funding and academic research allow drugs to be developed more quickly, and are an investment by our government with our tax dollars toward our best interests. And isn't that what our tax dollars are supposed to be for? That does not mean it is, or should be, a non-profit environment.

That last post was in response to hurricane hugo, no to you, pheonix58. Thanks for all you do.

Why are other countries allowed to sell the same drug for less than half the price? I know that the other countries do not have to pay for research and litigation. So basically America is providing the world with inexpensive drugs while footing the bill.

Pharmas charge what they do in the US because they can. Partially because of the messed up health insurance industry and because we are willing to pay.

whatever the market will bare.

Finally an intelligent comment. I thank you.

oh jeesh! I wish people that have never read Herbert Spencer ( or later Darwin) would quit using this term. Biologists do not use this term. Here is an example: If there is a super bug that is killing millions of people but only people working for pharmaceutical companies have access to the cure---- then the employees of the pharmaceutical company are the "fittest" They may be the whitest, wimpiest group of nerds you have ever seen but in this scenario they are the fittest and only they survive to pass on their genetics.

it's funny how just about everyone who uses the phrase "survival of the fittest" automatically assume they're one of the fittest.

#@!

LOL Hugo! Right you are!

I do not want to be one of the survivors if something like this really does happen. Stephen King's The Stand is the rated G version of what we could expect for survivors. Reality would be far, far worse. No way Jose for me.

Gives me fits!

Fittest is definitely not the right word, unless you use it to mean aggressiveness or taking advantage of others.

I wonder how advanced our technology and science would be if we hadn't evolved as much by this survival of the fittest. Peaceful intelligent societies with vast knowledge and advanced cultures centuries ago were wiped out or had their cities and libraries burned to the ground by barbarians or invading forces who were only after gold, land, or slave labor. So, in these scenarios, brute force was considered the fittest traits and intelligence and culture were not.

For humans, the ones who can afford the essentials to survive and the thugs who can wrestle or steal it from others will be the survivors of the human race. Neither of these groups by themselves would be very good at long term survival since they both depend heavily on resources provided by others and would probably have a hard time providing their own. When you run out of food wealth can't buy it and brute force can't steal it. Somebody has to hunt or grow it and will have to spend most of their resources protecting what little food they can hunt or grow.

the term survival of the fittest as I understand it refers to the existence of traits that allow an organism to adapt and thrive in the prevailing environment. Humans are actually not all that fit as lone units and factors of the survival of humans is largley due to our ability to work in societal units and being able to understand and exersize some control over our environment.

Of course, the number one breeding ground of antibiotic resistant bacteria are the factory farms, where animals are packed into unsanitary conditions that would normally result in the majoity of the flock being infected, so to make up for it we pump them full of antibiotics. Gee, how could creating an environment where bacteria have tons of opportunity to breed, grow, and mutate, and then filling that environment with every antibiotic known to man POSSIBLY lead to the development of these superbugs? Oh well, don't worry about it, we've got to squeeze every last penny out of livestock in our race to the bottom to make sure the US gets its quota of obesity-producing, low-quality McDonalds hamburgers.

One could say our cities full of millions of people are also a factory farm for raising people. We are packed tight and share an easy pathway for disease to spread.

Ken G-1830160

Agreed, but the "villains" you cite are also guilty of exclusivity pricing in their pursuit of being gods. There was a time when doctors made house calls; they saw the living standard of patients and charged accordingly. Such actions did make them true crusaders and helpers. Neither is being done today. So patients go where fees are more reasonable but still over-priced. The result is as expected; everyone is compromised. The medical profession is failing to the level it deserves. Better devise a new approach that does not include corporate health medical providers--your wages are destine to become equal to other factory workers and they will ship your jobs overseas too. What comes around goes around.

So your solution is what? Disallow the use of antibiotics and other drugs that allow people to survive illnesses, thereby needlessly killing people? But at least there won't be superbugs? Puhleez. It's evolution (ever heard of it?). Bacteria evolve too, ya know. New drugs are created every day, and it's not just overuse of these drugs that creates "superbugs", it's also the unsanitary conditions and lack of drugs in other countries (notice how India and Pakistan are the breeding ground here, not the U.S., to which your complaints are directed) that are allowing these bugs to grow.

You cannot stop evolution, sir. Eventually, life finds a way (you ever watch Jurassic Park? Granted it's fiction, but engineering only female dinosaurs led to...male dinosaurs, 'cause life finds a way, as Goldblum's character said).

Do I agree with you that doctors overprescribe some medications? Certainly. But is this the reason for superbugs? Hardly. And stop with the "Big Pharma" conspiracies. It's ludicrous to think that pharma companies work hard to create and sell medicines so that bacteria can grow resistant to them. That's stupid, as it would DECREASE the company's profits once bugs grow resistant and the medicine no longer works. But keep dreaming!

The reason MRSA and other superbugs exist is because nothing keeps them in check. MSNBC published an article just this week on how MRSA infections are DECREASING across this nation, due to better sanitary practices in hospitals, even at a time where "Big Pharma" is creating more drugs. So that runs exactly counter to your argument. Good day sir!

Your comment on the new super viruses are correct. Besides the misuse of our current antibiotics, the aspects of world travel by various individuals to foreign countries and then traveling back to the U.S., Great Britain, etc. are a problem in itself. Rather it be for vacation purposes or medical, the rates at which infectious viruses can be carried are un-controllable since many people with money can seek cosmetic surgery in other countries. My point is, since we can't stop travel, what can be done to curb the threat ?

Dear Ken, I would like to thank you for using both knowledge gathered and your heart in order to do your best to live up to your name: ken of small letters.

ken

ken [ken]
n
knowledge: somebody's knowledge or understanding
It's beyond my ken.

vti (past kenned or kent [kent], past participle kenned or kent, present participle ken·ning, 3rd person present singular kens)
Scotland Same as know

[ Old English cennan "make known" < Indo-European]
Encarta ® World English Dictionary © & (P) 1998-2005 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.

(But look out at all times for "big head" syndrome. At all times remember that the world is both a pearl and an onion. There is no one cause, but a horrid layering effect over time. In fact, the human creation is the ONE creation with abilities to ward off and overcome certain naturally occuring "attackers", but ONLY when allowed to be maintained with loving respect to optimal balance of all put INTO it and that absolutely includes the emotional state it is often born to, taught to and often held to by both personal (sick; immature; lacking truthful information) choices.

Patients are like spoiled rotten sniveling snotty children, demanding of doctors "a pill" for whatever ails them. Doctors should have them report to a Weight Watchers meeting JUST TO LEARN of balance and moderation and how good it is to simply GO FOR A WALK.

They line up for a new liver, then feed it more wine and whine some more yet. Hardly the Lord's intention!

These are all relevant points though there is really a better statistical answer. As populations increase the probability and frequency of mutation also increases, though I don't know the relationship specifically. We are growing and mixing populations at rate unseen before in human history. I am frankly amazed we have not had a major event more recently. The use, or overuse of antibiotics in some cases may be the stopgap which has prevented a major pandemic or the development of strains of bugs completey impervious to know treatments. It also may have been a temporary measure.

I thought the breeding grounds for the drug resistant bugs were in the health care facilities, where they developed resistance to all the antibiotics and antibiotic soaps and so forth. I remember a patient in isolation in the ICU as far back as the 80's who was sick with bugs that no antibiotic they were trying could kill. We PT's were warned to stay away. I also had a lot of experience dealing with MRSA, for which we had to dress up like Darth Vader to treat. I tend not to freak out about these bugs without a lot more information.

seen,

It's a good bet, but it is not perfectly clear if these bugs start in the facilities or are brought it, then easiloy passed through the population of teh facility due to the nature of care, i.e. a lot of human contact.

Seems more like the vanity of those looking for cheap cosmetic surgery, with it's attendant waste of resources, will wind up killing the world.

Good points Ricky, but these events serve as opportunities to learn and try to predict, and perhaps prevent more significant events.

This is not the same, and your assumptions are not true.

Just ONE example- The Spanish Flu killed more people than the Black Death and nothing worked on it. It was avian flu; very much like the one 5 years ago. We got lucky on that

Or maybe the Spanish Flu survivors survived because their genetic makeup was different from those the flu killed. And we are these survivor's descendants. Maybe. I hope so. Until they make anti-flu shots with something other than chicken's eggs, I, allergic to chickens, am grass.

NOPE

We had survivors, because the flu mutated away from its deadly version... again- like the avian flu did, a few years ago. You really don't know how lucky we got.

Actually the Spanish Flu in 1918 killed more people than died in WW1. H1N1 was similarly virulent/contagious but less pathologic. And many who had been infected with H1N1 never knew it. Of course about a third of those who caught polio only developed mild respiratory symptoms too...

the main point was that they were both avian flus, but yeah

Key, is it in any way, shape or form, satisfying to live a conspiracy theory life? If so, do provide ALL of your insights so that others may avoid catching what YOU have. Good LORD! If we're all going to speak a second language on a mandatory basis, EVERYBODY knows it will be Mandarin! Get in the game, Key! Oh, and watch out for those pesky gators. They've been know to attack when poked with a stick or if you put your hand in their mouths!

The People of the Corn LIVE!

That is sarcasm, right Gator? I live in ND and even up here you would need a big crowd that was pretty drunk to find someone that delusional.

Wonder what Gator's gonna do, when he catches sumthin in the swamp

blame it on politics?

Don't git bit by a Coral Snake, Gator- they don't make that anti-venon anymore. Obama told em not to (or was it Bush?).

I'd respond to Gator but them black helicopters are giving me a headache.

I'm sorry, but I'm with KWG. Just wait, this new superbug will be an excuse to add another MANDATED vaccine to the list, costing taxpayers billions. No control of the people over your own bodies. DO WHAT BIG BROTHER SAYS!!!

Fascinating how when the West's healthcare and medical industries are threatened by low-cost, high-quality care in India, that reports like this come out of the woodwork.

No matter. As Mahatma Gandhi said, "First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win". This is Stage 3 of that process. And India is in this to win.

Economic inequity has a way of spreading around, sometimes in other arenas.

Don't blame the third world- it was women shopping for tummy tucks and nose jobs

those are tourists saving a buck, not locals.

daineric,

Finding new antibiotics should be a function of the NIH, properly funded by the government and not left to the profit driven motives of the pharm industry.

Are you kidding? That would be a recipe for disaster.

Wouldn't you prefer that the best and brightest work on the problem, rather than those who would be content to be mediocre for the government? The profit motive is exactly what recruits the best and brightest. You don't have to like it, but if you'd like good results, you should accept it.

Not to mention the hue and cry that would be raised by those who think the government can provide additional services without increasing taxes. R&D is expensive and can't be put on a convenient political timeline.

I really don't know why the emergence of a new and improved super bacteria should come as any surprise to anyone. It's been a problem in the making for a variety of reasons, as most have pointed out on this Newsvine. I'm not into Apocolyptic thinking and I'm certainly not going to let this worry me. However, I do find a little bit of irony in the comparison of a bacteria wiping out how ever many millions of people to that of what happened to the fictional aliens who invaded earth in the fictional movie War of The Worlds.

If it can happen to Movieland, and if it has happened before in actual history, then why not now? Remember, in REAL life, previous scourges got around the globe with out fast trains, planes, automobiles, high-end cosmetic surgery in "low places", or any other method EXCEPT HUMAN CARRIERS and their cargos.

The notion that we've in some form or fashion done something wrong, or these people seeking lower cost medical and cosmetic surgery options are to BLAME, is preposterous. They are no more to blame than our soldiers serving in Iraq and Iran are for whatever they bring home!

This is no "new" phenomenon! It has occurred over and over and OVER again throughout the world's history. As to global warming, no surprise there either. . .think Dust Bowl which was due to man's abuse of land with NO attention given to replanting for the long haul, and think Ice Age which, well, killed off all the dinosaurs and the humans who lived along side them (insert rolling eyes here).

Mankind is the architect of its own demise. We've survived and lengthened our lifespan BECAUSE of the research and development of treatments and drugs to keep these ugly bugs at bay. Happens to be Big Pharma is to thank for that one. Unfortunately, so many other aspects of "industry" in our lives help to contribute to a continuing decline our health. That's the way the coin rolls, okay?

Newsflash: At SOME point, we're ALL going to die. Hopefully, it won't be at the same exact time and I think that is still highly unlikely. But, instead of thinking of death as some sort of thing to fear, especially since it's been happening since the beginning of our existence on earth, think of it as a natural part of the life process. There ARE worse things than death, people!

Now, go on about your day and ENJOY IT! Be happy and find something to smile about. Try this one on for size: YOU'RE ALIVE. . . today, that is!

Peace, brothers and sisters!

Economan,

the federal government already funds the large majority of that research, and has done so for decades. yet it (meaning the taxpayers) receives none of the profits.

#@!

You're joking right? The NIH already pours alot of money into antibiotic research. Most of it goes into joint university/hospital research that usually also involves a pharma corp. Pharm corps do not like to sink too much of their money into antibiotics because they're a one and done treatment. They're like your cell phone company, or your crack dealer, they want to hook you for life. Pharma doesnt make a ton of money off antibiotics or vaccines, they make their money of Viagra and Lipitor. That's why NIH and other gov agencies push the early stages of investigation and then hand off or sell the best candidates to pharma.

By the way, the best and brightest scientific minds are generally not in corporate, they're in university or gov labs. Most scientists could care less about salary, they want to do independent research. Profit motive works for many things, but not for driving scientific research. How many nobel winners work for corps? how many for universities...?