bspurloc, you are an idiot. You always manage to find some way to squeeze religion or politics into everything under the sun. I think you are probably a frustrated, narrow minded individual who has severe sociopathic tendancies and cannot even stand to live with yourself. Either get a life or get off the planet before you hurt an innocent individual.

Why do they never say how many of the people who have died or are in the hospital already did get the vaccine? Are these people dying because they didn't get the shot, or are they dying anyway? Just wondering.

Yes,for the last 10,000 years humans have relied on vaccinations for a long healthy life.....oh wait its only been 50 years.I wonder how we ever made it this far without our life saving vaccinations.....Oh well maybe the bible has some answers...

Maybe the Bible has some answers.....

The Bible has a long dissertation on what cleanliness is. When it is followed, the death rate drops.

Did WHO and the drug companies ever read the story about the boy who cried wolf?

It's called Urine Therapy, it's been practiced for over 4000 years. Google it, it will save your life. It's a little edgy but it works. It's the original vaccine. From your body to your body.

Actually you have a very good point.If you do enough research most if not all diseases were eliminated by in-door plumbing and refrigeration not aluminum formaldehyde and half dead viruses.

how we ever made it

Simple - millions didn't. They died - leaving those alive who had some immunity to the disease. The "back death" took millions of Europeans - leaving those with immunity. That wasn't all bad - unless of course - you and yours were among those who died.

Vaccinations have saved millions of people who otherwise would have died from the many diseases that exist. And - keep in mind that people bitten by rabid animals can thank God that vaccinations exist for that disease.

And - your timeline is off - Jenner first used vaccination on a boy called James Phipps in 1796. People who got vaccinated after that didn't have to die from Smallpox.

In short - do some research - get educated about the history of vaccinations.

Brickwall2

I have researched vaccines for about 12 years now.I don't profess to know everything about the topic I sure understand how to follow the money!

I am well aware of the history but was referring to the mass vaccination campaigns of the 50's(polio).The height of the disease was in the 20's ( North America) and the disease was almost gone when they brought out their useless garbage...look it up for yourself.Just google "the truth about Polio"and it will bring up hundred's of article.And some of the graphs that prove this info are from the CDC!

We were waiting for YOU to post your drivel, dear bspurloc. You did not disaapoint us, either.

bspurloc

Your post is perfect....except for the autism, flu, and ufo activity that vaccines cause.

I believe they caused the Vietnam War, too.

Jeez...conspiracy theorists come out of the woodwork whenever something is discovered that benefits mankind.

And citing the Bible?? No comment.

It is just a matter of time as to when H1N1 mixes genetically with H5N1. Then after that, our planet will be relieved of OUR Human overpopulation Problem. Nature knows ALL with her natural "circuit Breakers" to keep All species in line.

All vaccinations are not bad, and the polio vaccine is a success story. However, all polio vaccines were not the same either. When short cuts are taken in production, the vaccine can actually transmit the disease. When this happens, the results can be catastrophic, and since there's no way to say whether the individual could have come down with polio eventually, a life is wasted. Pharmaceutical companies must be held to the highest standards, and unfortunately they're more interested in profits. There's not an easy solution to this problem.

Another problem these days is the fact that vaccines are being pushed on the public in mass quantities, for diseases which are only fatal in most cases where the individual's immune system is already compromised. For the most part, with a disease like flu, these individuals shouldn't take vaccines because their systems are too weak to begin with. In other words their immune system is already so weak, it can't produce antibodies and the vaccine could kill them. For the rest of the population with healthy immune systems, they will most likely recover with rest, fluids, and normal care. It's not going to be comfortable, and they'll lose a few days of work, but they'll be fine. There are going to be some that fall through the cracks and die, but nothing like what the CDC has predicted.

Vaccines for diseases like polio are probably necessary, but I just don't see the flu vaccine being warranted. I know this will make some people go off, but the times in history where the flu killed millions, there were other circumstances which amplified the spread and the severity of the casualties. I just don't see that happening this winter or anytime soon. Just like last year, the numbers are few, and the ones that do die have other problems. You will notice that no one even tabulates the numbers of the infected who were also vaccinated. Could this be because the vaccine is actually spreading the disease? We'll never know. Do your own study; count how many you know that were vaccinated who later came down with it. I did last year; it was 2 for 2, and one of those also came down with GBS.

But look our for these individuals who make fun of those that don't believe government propaganda and scare tactics designed to sell somebody's snake oil. They'll label you, and I'm sure me too as a conspiracy nut. That's fine. But think about how many times have we been lied to by government or corporate america, just to make a buck for somebody? I've seen it one time too many and I am through taking anyone's word just because they are an official or have MD in front of their name.

Could this be because the vaccine is actually spreading the disease? We'll never know.

I love the ignorance of people. The vaccine protects against a few strains that are predicted to be the widespread strains in the coming year. It doesn't protect against all of them. Your conclusion is that since vaccinated people are getting sick means that the vaccine caused the sickness? Um, no. It just means that they got a strain that was different from those in the vaccine.

When short cuts are taken in production, the vaccine can actually transmit the disease.

I also love when people take examples from the 1950s, like the polio outbreak from one set of vaccines, and try to say they could happen again today. As if our standards haven't gotten better in the last 60 years. There are things called cGMPs (current good manufacturing practices) that are employed by pharma and vaccine companies to prevent this. This couldn't happen again without gross negligence, at which point the company would be shut down. So enough of your conspiracy theories.

The drug companies OWN studies show the vaccines only help 1 in 100, and that is if you believe it helps that many, of which I DON'T.

Ask you doctor what's in the vaccine, and then go home and do some research. After you find out you have taking mercury, formaldehyde and a host of other toxins, then ask yourself if maybe Bill Gates was right when he said if vaccines are done correctly, they can reduce the world population by 10-15 percent.

Personally, I could care less if you think everything I just said is BS. Go get the shots if you want, just be informed before you do.

As for these 27 people, it's to bad big pharma don't tell people that vitamin D deficiency is what most likely killed them. People with high Vitamin D levels rarely get colds or the flu. In the winter, when you don't get direct sunlight due to the tilt of the earth and the time you spend outside, Vit D drops and you have the 'flu season'. Funny, Australia has their 'flu season' when its summer in the US. Due to the tilt of the earth, Australians don't get enough direct sunlight and their Vitamin D levels drop.... hello colds and flu....

I love the ignorance of people

And I love it when Penguins call us ignorant in an attempt to cover up the truth.

Your conclusion is that since vaccinated people are getting sick means that the vaccine caused the sickness? Um, no. It just means that they got a strain that was different from those in the vaccine.

Um, no. It doesn't mean anything of the sort. I'm talking about cases where an individual was vaccinated for a type of flu and still came down with that type of flu, not another. It means that the individual still got sick even though he was vaccinated. It means the vaccination didn't work. It could mean that the vaccine gave the individual the flu, as it has happened before. Any moron, except maybe you could figure this out. Your reaction could mean that you work for a pharmaceutical company, or you're just stupid.

I also love when people take examples from the 1950s, like the polio outbreak from one set of vaccines, and try to say they could happen again today.

This is not from the 1950s. I was involved with the campaign led by a worldwide charitable organization to eradicate Polio. In the 1990s, some of the vaccines we distributed in third world countries actually gave a few children polio. It didn't happen often, but our internal investigation led us to believe it was a production problem. In our efforts to vaccinate everyone, we had to hold down costs to get as many people covered as possible. All vaccines are not equal.

Look out for people who post messages making fun of others who question vaccines. Their agenda is fuzzy; their reasoning questionable.

And Patrick, you are right on the money. Vitamin D.

The drug companies OWN studies show the vaccines only help 1 in 100

Patrick, until you provide evidence for anything you say, why should we believe you?

Go get the shots if you want, just be informed before you do.

Ironic that you say this, because you couldn't be less informed than you are. You got those very shots as a kid, yet here you are ranting and raving that they make you sick. What a bogus argument.

And Patrick, you are right on the money. Vitamin D.

Yeah, Ben...when you encounter dangerous microbes, Vitamin D is a force field that will protect you from getting ill. Seriously???

In the 1990s, some of the vaccines we distributed in third world countries actually gave a few children polio

So you're basing your whole philosophy on an isolated incident. Brilliant.

Penguin.

Go do some research on sites NOT backed by big pharma before putting others down. Maybe you will learn two things.

First, Vitamin D is the most important thing you can do for your health.

Second, you are ignorant and were sadly misinformed by the evil corporations who make money off you being sick.

If you want to believe big pharma and all their 'studies', be my guest.

Its like asking a pedophile to babysit your kids!!!

Penguin, are you really this stupid? You really believe that your vaccinations are more important than a healthy immune system? Wow. Where did you get this information? So in order for your body to fight off infection, it's necessary to take a vaccine?

Go do some research on sites NOT backed by big pharma before putting others down.

If you'd only show evidence to back your ridiculous accusations...

First, Vitamin D is the most important thing you can do for your health.

Nobody's denying Vitamin D's benefits, but it's not going to protect you from dangerous microbes. It's beneficial, but not the end all be all of preventative medicine.

Second, you are ignorant and were sadly misinformed by the evil corporations who make money off you being sick.

Ignorant? Really? How many "big pharma" companies make vaccines? Hardly any, because they are NOT profitable. I love how people accuse them of "making money by making you sick". Before you write your drivel, do you even think about what you type?

You really believe that your vaccinations are more important than a healthy immune system?

What? This doesn't make any sense. The vaccinations MAKE your immune system healthy, dummy. They train it. When you're born, your immune system has ZERO ability to prevent illness. The less vaccines you have, the more energy and white blood cells your body has to use to remove the invading viruses and bacteria. With vaccines, your body's immune system is built up without the danger of getting sick from real viruses and bacteria.

It's as if you think that you're born with immunity for all these disease. You're not! Your immune system starts at zero when you're born. Yes, your body can fight off most infections and defend them for the most part, but that compromises the child's immune system right off the bat, and zaps the energy and defenses away from real challenges. Think about how many people handle an infant from the time it's born until the time it gets home. The infant's body will be overcome by all of the microbes out in the world, even the regular everyday viruses, without vaccines handling the dangerous ones.

So yes, the body can fight off infection, but it takes a lot longer to do so and compromises the child's health. An infant should not have to go through heaven and hell just to get home.

So in order for your body to fight off infection, it's necessary to take a vaccine?

No, your immune system has to recognize the invading bacteria, develop an immune response, grow enough antibodies to counter the invaders, then escort them out of the body, all the while creating fever, zapping energy, and causing the body's cells to divert from regular activity to help with the response. This is fine for non-dangerous microbes, but for dangerous microbes, the body will succumb to these ravaging diseases before the immune response is developed. That is why we have vaccines...to battle these microbes BEFORE the disease hurts the body. So that the disease does not settle into the body and hurt us while we develop an immune response. So yes, the body can fight most diseases. But by the time an infant's developing immune system fights back, it could be too late.

Meningitis is caught by unvaccinated college-age kids. Before their bodies can develop an immune response, the disease kills them. Simple vaccines prevent this. Why would you let disease ravage your body instead of helping your immune system out with a simple vaccine?

The vaccinations MAKE your immune system healthy

Really? Hadn't heard that one before. What a whopper.

How many "big pharma" companies make vaccines? Hardly any, because they are NOT profitable.

Oh, so the pharmaceutical companies do all this work for charity? That's very nice of them. I had no idea. Please continue.

When you're born, your immune system has ZERO ability to prevent illness.

If this is true, I guess it's a good thing your momma came equipped with boobs (breast milk has some good things in it, but you wouldn't know about that.) So according to you, we were all saved when we were born by a batch of vaccines? And this goes back to when, 1900? 1800? What did people do before that? How did the species not just die off? So I guess the dinosaurs just didn't get their vaccines.

The less vaccines you have, the more energy and white blood cells your body has to use to remove the invading viruses and bacteria.

You might be right here, but I found the rest of your argument ridiculous and mostly without merit. So I skipped to the end.

Why would you let disease ravage your body instead of helping your immune system out with a simple vaccine?

I wouldn't. However, injecting an artificial substance cooked up by companies with questionable ethics that sometimes contains things like mercury and other bad things isn't my first choice. We run across bad bugs all the time that our immune system manages to fight off without us even knowing it. To say that vaccines are what saves us is ridiculous. They haven't been around that long. For polio, I think it was a success, but for the flu, not even close. So thanks but no thanks. You take them, and please let us know how it works out for you.

Really? Hadn't heard that one before. What a whopper.

So you hadn't heard that tricking your body into producing antibodies for deadly diseases via vaccines helps your immune system? You're even more ignorant than I thought!

Oh, so the pharmaceutical companies do all this work for charity?

Look it up yourself. The fact that they produce so much vaccine and the unused portion is returned doesn't give them much profit. That's why most of the big companies are out of the vaccine business entirely. Again, look up who makes the childhood vaccines...it isn't the Pfizer's, J&J's, and Glaxo's of the world.

If this is true, I guess it's a good thing your momma came equipped with boobs (breast milk has some good things in it, but you wouldn't know about that.)

I love how you question this fact. It's like you can't admit it's true. Yeah, it's a good thing you get breast milk, because is measles immunity transferred via breast milk? No. Mumps? No. Tetanus, Hep, TB, Polio? No, no, no, and no. Do you still believe that if a Rottweiler's tail is chopped off then it's offspring will have no tail too? Yikes! The infant gets TEMPORARY immunity for some things via blood during fetal development, but this wears off after a year to 18 months. After that, no immunity for anything unless he/she is exposed to it. Ignorance is bliss, though, isn't it?

You might be right here, but I found the rest of your argument ridiculous and mostly without merit. So I skipped to the end.

You seem to have skipped a lot in your "understanding" of vaccines and how they work and are manufactured.

So according to you, we were all saved when we were born by a batch of vaccines? And this goes back to when, 1900? 1800? What did people do before that?

Okay, check that, you seem to have skipped a lot in your understanding of infant mortality and illness rates. Before vaccines, many infants DIED and/or got PERMANENTLY SICK. But forget about that little "meaningless" statistic, right? What's wrong with kids getting polio, dying from preventable diseases, and getting whole classrooms sick with a few "unlucky" ones dying from these diseases? Again, YIKES!

I wouldn't.

Oh, I see...you have a choice as to who gets sick and who doesn't. I get it. Your healthy kids wouldn't get sick because you wouldn't "let" the disease ravage his/her body, while others' kids die from these diseases. Didn't realize it was a choice as to who lived and died! Sorry, my bad! LMAO!

We run across bad bugs all the time that our immune system manages to fight off without us even knowing it.

Yeah, NOW we do because we've eliminated the spread of many of the "bad bugs" via vaccines! As if these bugs are no longer a threat! One needs only to look at Oregon and California outbreaks to see that reduced vaccination rates cause the diseases to come back...they're there in the environment, and it's the vaccines that are preventing us from being sick. Our immune systems get hit with these bugs all the time, and it's the vaccines we got as a kid that are saving our health. It's the vaccines we had decades ago that help our immune systems fight these bad bugs today.

For polio, I think it was a success, but for the flu, not even close.

Again, you just don't understand what causes these diseases. Polio -- ONE virus. Flu -- MANY different strains of virus. Therefore, we can protect against polio with one shot, but the flu virus is ever-changing. Different strains come around each year, which is why new shots are required. Poliovirus developed and evolved over the course of centuries and millenia, with a dangerous strain eventually evolving. Our vaccine has eliminated its spread, and has caused it to no longer evolve, since it doesn't have enough hosts to go through natural selection. The flu is different, and is constantly evolving, a bad strain of which just evolved in H1N1, which the CDC learned about and identified a year before its worldwide circulation, which allowed them to develop the vaccine in concert with its spread. Again, read up on the reasons for the vaccines and you might learn something. Talking out of your @$$ does you no good.

Our vaccine has eliminated its spread

Your vaccine? You developed the polio vaccine? I thought that was Jonas Salk. So you're from the government and you're here to help us? Or you're just smarter than the rest of us dumb citizens? But do tell us, which drug company do you work for?

You're even more ignorant than I thought!

Of course you would. This is the exactly what I would expect from someone in the drug business. You probably think everyone but yourself is ignorant. It’s good for business.

So you hadn't heard that tricking your body into producing antibodies for deadly diseases via vaccines helps your immune system?

Yes, I'm familiar with the auto immune response. We all are. But only a healthy immune system can fight diseases. I know you would like to be able to sell us our immune system, but most of us already came equipped. A weak immune system on the other hand can't fight nearly as well and it doesn't matter how many vaccines you take if your immune system is compromised. Any idiot but apparently you knows this. Or do you know it, and just don't want to admit it?

Again, look up who makes the childhood vaccines...it isn't the Pfizer's, J&J's, and Glaxo's of the world.

Please tell us, who is it then? Is it your company?

Before vaccines, many infants DIED and/or got PERMANENTLY SICK

I got news for you. Infants still die and still get PERMANENTLY SICK. Autism is pretty permanent. Some parents even believe their children's sudden onset of autism is directly related to the vaccines that their kid just received. We also have soldiers from the first gulf war who have this mysterious syndrome that is tied to some vaccines they were given. They're PERMANENTLY SICK too. But these people are probably just dreaming all this up to slander the drug companies and the CDC. And I'm sure those veterans are just trying to get disability too. Sure they are.

Different strains come around each year, which is why new shots are required.

No, new shots are required so that the manufacturer can make a profit. New shots are required because somebody wants to inject millions of people with a foreign substance which in some cases make people sick. My friend was partially paralyzed last year because of your flu vaccine. I was there. I saw it. You didn't. You probably know of cases like his, but it's no big deal as long as you made a profit. You weren't the one who was paralyzed though.

And what exactly is the long term affect on the body from being injected with all of these shots over the course of one's lifetime? What is the affect on a newborn from injecting it with a batch of vaccines right off the bat? Anybody? Longer life? Shorter life? GBS? Sterility? Gulf War Syndrome? Autism? The truth is, you don't know. Or worse, you do know, you just don't want others to find out. You can flap your gums all you want but you really can't even prove that the flu vaccine actually works.

Again, read up on the reasons for the vaccines and you might learn something. Talking out of your @$$ does you no good.

I did. There's plenty of information out there about your vaccines, and how to avoid disease. There is a lot of information here about how sanitation and clean water has played a major role in preventing disease. This is an excellent source, but it's just one of many.

http://thinktwice.com/

Here are a few clips about your flu vaccine from just this one website. These stories are from individuals who took your vaccine but it is just the part that deals with the flu. There are other sections on your other vaccines;

[Flu102] My husband had a flu shot in January and experienced swelling in his axilla that night, probably the lymph nodes. After that, he became weak and chilled all the time, with a dry cough. During the next two months, the coughing, weakness and chills persisted, and by the end of the second month he was vomiting. His doctor did several tests until one showed acute kidney failure. He was diagnosed with Goodpastures syndrome. This condition causes an abnormal amount of antibodies in the blood, causing them to attack the kidneys and lungs. The treatment is immune suppressive therapy. Isn't that ironic. It seems that the flu shot that is supposed to build up immunity caused his to work too hard and didn't know when to shut down. Needless to say, the doctors refuse to admit that the flu shot caused this. He has been unable to work, gets tired, and is at increased risk of catching a virus due to drug therapy.

[Flu134] I had a flu shot in November, and by December I became weak and continued to get weaker until I collapsed in my bedroom and was taken to the hospital. I was surrounded with intravenous lines, a feeding tube, bladder catheter, and tracheotomy for the ventilator. I was helpless, totally paralyzed with Guillain-Barre syndrome. I had a blood infection, pneumonia, a fever of 107.9 degrees, and blood pressure of 44 over zero. My wife was told to make arrangements for a post-mortem. I was ICU for three weeks and then transferred to a rehabilitation center. Three months later I was released to come home because I could ambulate approximately 100 feet with a walker. I continued rehabilitation as an outpatient for the next three months until I could walk with hand crutches. Today I need a cane. I was not forewarned of any possible hazard when they gave me the flu shot.

[Flu203] I received a flu shot in November, and in January I started to get a body rash. I am achy in my (vaccine) arm and neck. I believe the shot may be responsible for my misery.

[Flu214] Three years ago I was given one of only four flu shots I ever had. What was unknown to me was that a strain of mono was included in the vaccine. I believe it was this strain that infected me and almost killed me. The next year, unaware and never warned by doctors, I took the flu shot again. This time it contained a deadly strain that put me in ICU fighting for my life.

[Flu253] My wife was diagnosed with subcutaneous T-cell lymphoma after receiving a flu shot. The doctor did not write down the brand or lot number. Two weeks after receiving the flu shot, lumps started appearing on her legs.

[Flu325] I have a friend who received a flu vaccine on Monday and by Tuesday she was very sick. After many tests the doctors said it was not a reaction to the flu shot. Their diagnosis was "reactivated mono" -- despite the fact that she never had mono. I have heard many people swear that they'll never get another flu vaccine. Now I understand.

I appreciate your comments Penguin. If you hadn't said what you did, I wouldn't have even found this website. But it seems to me you're the one who needs to learn how to read. Talking out of your ass does you no good, indeed.

Your vaccine? You developed the polio vaccine?

The human race. Anybody can get that out of what I said. Except for you, apparently. The polio vaccine allowed us not to get sick with the virus. Wow, you really are trying to stretch everything to fit your narrow-minded view, aren't you?

This is the exactly what I would expect from someone in the drug business.

Last I checked, it wasn't just the "drug business insiders" that believed that the vaccine eliminated the virus' spread. But you keep thinking that!

But only a healthy immune system can fight diseases.

And what makes an infant's immune system healthy? Vaccines. It can only SLOWLY fight diseases that it has no prior knowledge of. Vaccines teach the immune system, allowing it to function more efficiently, so you DON'T allow infants to get sick just to get immunity. How stupid is it to allow infants to succumb to disease so they won't get it in the future? So some die, right? That's the price of not getting vaccinated...but YOUR kid won't die, right? Yikes. You are ignorant.

Please tell us, who is it then? Is it your company?

I've never worked for a company that had vaccines in its portfolio, sorry. No bias here. Again, look up who makes the childhood vaccines...it's not anyone on the Fortune 500 list.

I got news for you. Infants still die and still get PERMANENTLY SICK. Autism is pretty permanent.

ARE YOU SERIOUS??? Autism has not been linked to vaccines (btw, my wife's brother is autistic). Please show me where autism's been linked to vaccines...all scientific studies have shown NO CORRELATION, much less causation. Sounds like you're believing Internet rumors again!

There is a lot of information here about how sanitation and clean water has played a major role in preventing disease.

While I agree that sanitation has improved, etc. and plays a major role in preventing disease, this DOES NOT however imply that vaccines did not play a major role as well, nor does it imply that without vaccines disease would've been reduced in the same capacity. Yes, better sanitation reduces the spread of disease, but vaccines prevent those that do come into contact with these viruses and bacteria from suffering from the diseases that accompany them. No amount of handwashing and clean water is going to prevent you from contracting polio, etc. if you are unvaccinated. That's a fact.

You are seriously misinformed, especially about the autism-vaccines issue. My suggestion: read actual scientific literature, not Internet garbage.

Exactly how do you prove that you didn’t get sick because you were vaccinated, even for polio? How do you know you weren’t already immune? Did you know that some people are naturally immune to polio?

Many people mistakenly believe that anyone who contracts polio will become paralyzed or die. However, in most infections caused by polio there are few distinctive symptoms.(2) In fact, 95 percent of everyone who is exposed to the natural polio virus won't exhibit any symptoms, even under epidemic conditions.(3,4) About 5 percent of infected people will experience mild symptoms, such as a sore throat, stiff neck, headache, and fever -- often diagnosed as a cold or flu.(5,6) Muscular paralysis has been estimated to occur in about one of every 1,000 people who contract the disease.(7,8) This has lead some scientific researchers to conclude that the small percentage of people who do develop paralytic polio may be anatomically susceptible to the disease. The vast remainder of the population may be naturally immune to the polio germ.(9)

Why don't they look into why some are naturally immune instead of injecting everyone? Well, there's no money in that, but here's something more:

Injections: Several studies have shown that injections (for antibiotics or other vaccines) increase susceptibility to polio. In fact, researchers have known since the early 1900s that paralytic poliomyelitis often started at the site of an injection.(10,11) When diphtheria and pertussis vaccines were introduced in the 1940s, cases of paralytic poliomyelitis skyrocketed [Figure 1].(12) This was documented in Lancet and other medical journals.(13-15) In 1949, the Medical Research Council in Great Britain set up a committee to investigate the matter and ultimately concluded that individuals are at increased risk of paralysis for 30 days following injections; injections alter the distribution of paralysis; and it did not matter whether the injections were subcutaneous or intramuscular.(16,17)

A 1992 study, published in the Journal of Infectious Diseases, validated earlier findings. Children who received DPT (diphtheria, tetanus, and pertussis) injections were significantly more likely than controls to suffer paralytic poliomyelitis within the next 30 days.(18) According to the authors, "this study confirms that injections are an important cause of provocative poliomyelitis."(19)

In 1995, the New England Journal of Medicine published a study showing that children who received a single injection within one month after receiving a polio vaccine were 8 times more likely to contract polio than children who received no injections. The risk jumped 27-fold when children received up to nine injections within one month after receiving the polio vaccine. And with ten or more injections, the likelihood of developing polio was 182 times greater than expected.(20)

Why injections increase the risk of polio is unclear.(21) Nevertheless, these studies and others(22-27) indicate that "injections must be avoided in countries with endemic poliomyelitis."(28) Health authorities believe that all "unnecessary" injections should be avoided as well.(29)

But according to you;

And what makes an infant's immune system healthy? Vaccines.

Are you nuts? Are you to have us believe that you actually think vaccines are what make an infant's immune system healthy? Nutrition, breast milk, the mother's health during pregnancy, none of these factors are as important as mercury poisoning? Are you really this stupid or do you just think we are?

so you DON'T allow infants to get sick

Where did I say anything about purposefully allowing infants to get sick?

Vaccines teach the immune system, allowing it to function more efficiently.

Horse hockey. How does mercury help your immune system function more efficiently?

So some die, right? That's the price of not getting vaccinated...

No, that is the ultimate price of getting vaccinated.

Again, look up who makes the childhood vaccines...it's not anyone on the Fortune 500 list.

I did. Pfizer, Glaxo Smithkline, Merck, the list goes on. These are not mom and pop operations. Are they on the Fortune 500 list? It would appear that you are either wrong again or you are lying, and they are making a fortune. They don't work for free.

Autism has not been linked to vaccines

No, they’re not going to do any studies that would allow this to happen. For one thing, who's going to conduct such a study, the pharmaceutical companies? Uh, no. CDC? Negative. But what exactly is the National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program? And why have they paid out two billion dollars to people who have been injured by your vaccines? Why have drug companies been given immunity from being sued by our government? If their products are so great and so safe, why would they need immunity? Two billion dollars? I understand it's not very easy getting compensation. What about the others who were not fortunate enough to be compensated? Sorry, but your vaccines don't sound very safe.

my wife's brother is autistic

Well, did he get all of his shots?

While I agree that sanitation has improved, etc. and plays a major role in preventing disease

A major role? Do you even know how polio is spread? Except for the children who were infected by bad batches of vaccine, polio is typically spread through contact with contaminated feces (for example, by changing an infected baby's diapers) or through airborne droplets, in food, or in water. The virus enters the body by nose or mouth, then travels to the intestines where it incubates. Simple modern santitation methods and clean drinking water are what killed this disease, at least in the industrialized world. Total eradication in the third world, however, will not happen until they fix their plumbing. It doesn't matter how many vaccines you give out, it's always going to be with us as long as there is @!$%# in the water.

You are seriously misinformed about what the affects of vaccines on the human body, especially about the autism-vaccines issue. My suggestion: quit listening to people who are just trying to sell you something.

People like you reveal your bias too easily. The thing that is glaringly obvious about all of this is you don't say anything about all the lives that vaccines have damaged. What to you is the difference between someone dying from the flu and someone dying from the flu vaccine? To me, the difference is the death caused by the flu was probably unavoidable, but the death caused by the vaccine was totally avoidable.

And don't tell me it doesn't happen because they wouldn't have created another bureau and be paying out billions of dollars if it wasn't. The government through their minions at the CDC, big pharma, and people like you are all responsible for the misery of possibly millions of people and you have the gall to call me "misinformed".

I also noticed you wouldn't even admit whether or not your wife's brother took vaccines. I have a nephew who has cerebral palsey and I know what happened to him. But that's the difference between me and people like you; you have no idea what caused your brother in law's condition, yet you're willing to just take the "expert's" word for it, and do nothing to keep it from happening again. Have you even looked up his vaccination records to see? Aren't you the least bit curious? And you call me ignorant.

Ben, you are seriously deluded. The Pfizers, Glaxos, Mercks, etc. do NOT make the CHILDHOOD vaccines that are mandatory.

How do you know you weren’t already immune? Did you know that some people are naturally immune to polio?

Just because you have no outward symptoms at first does not mean you're immune to poliovirus. You still get sick, meaning you're not immune. Your illogic is astounding.

Horse hockey. How does mercury help your immune system function more efficiently?

Mercury is not the agent for immunity, Ben. It's the preservative, making it inhospitable for microorganisms. The agent for immunity is the dead or attenuated virus. Your lack of understanding of vaccines prevents you from comprehending what you think you're talking about.

No, they’re not going to do any studies that would allow this to happen.

Ben, study after study confirms no link between vaccines and autism. The guy who initially made the link was just confirmed as a fraud. But go ahead and believe what you want...ignorance is bliss for you!

But what exactly is the National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program? And why have they paid out two billion dollars to people who have been injured by your vaccines?

Did I say no injuries occurred? No. Unfortunately for you, this program has shown time and time again that a child's autism is NOT from vaccines. Injuries, yes. Autism, no. Delusions of yours again?

Except for the children who were infected by bad batches of vaccine

You're seriously going to keep bringing this up? One incident 60 years ago does not mean the whole program is tainted. Yikes.

Me: my wife's brother is autistic

You: Well, did he get all of his shots?

You seriously need help. To say that all autistic kids got their condition from vaccines is ludicrous. Unvaccinated children get autism in the same proportion as vaccinated kids...meaning there is no autism risk via vaccines. How many studies have to disprove your supposed link? The "doctor" who discovered this was just proven as a fraud! A FRAUD! Does that mean nothing to you?

And until you have an autistic family member, stop ragging on those that do. These children are selfless and cannot fight battles for themselves, so your attacks are cruel and uncalled for.

Just because we've improved sanitation, etc. does NOT mean that it was the only cause of disease eradication. Nice myth, though! Talk about bias!

What to you is the difference between someone dying from the flu and someone dying from the flu vaccine?

The difference is the odds of dying. Much better chance of surviving a shot than surviving the flu. Any idiot can see that (well, maybe not ANY idiot).

I also noticed you wouldn't even admit whether or not your wife's brother took vaccines. I have a nephew who has cerebral palsey and I know what happened to him.

Cerebral palsy is not autism. You "know" what happened to him? Really? You were able to see the changes in his body at a cellular level and see that it had to be the vaccine? It doesn't seem like CP is from vaccines, sorry: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cerebral_palsy

While in certain cases there is no identifiable cause, typical causes include problems in intrauterine development (e.g. exposure to radiation, infection),, asphyxia before birth, hypoxia of the brain, and birth trauma during labor and delivery, and complications in the perinatal period or during childhood.

Nope, no vaccines there. But you KNOW something that science doesn't...good job there. I'm sure you spent every waking day with your nephew going over his signs and symptoms...oh wait, you saw him sporadically and ASSOCIATED the vaccines to what you saw. Yeah, good job Sherlock Holmes. You really nailed it there.

But that's the difference between me and people like you; you have no idea what caused your brother in law's condition, yet you're willing to just take the "expert's" word for it, and do nothing to keep it from happening again. Have you even looked up his vaccination records to see?

Most children get vaccinations near the time of autism diagnosis and symptoms and diagnosis. Coincidental timing does not mean causation, sorry. Go to a statistics class and learn something.

Berating me over an autistic's vaccine record? You've stooped to a new low. I feel sorry for you. You wouldn't even know an autistic child if you fell on top of him. You feel like these children are diseased or something. Again, I feel sorry for you.

or get married.............and then you ARE the dog.

With all due respect, not ALL women treat men like dogs.

That is true Countrygirl.

Any woman who treats a man who goes out and works so she can work or stay home like a second class citizen has some serious power issues.

With all due respect, not ALL women treat men like dogs

my apologies Countrygirl.........I meant no disrespect. Just trying to lighten the mood on a dreary day.

good morning desert rattler.

..but when a woman stops taking care of herself she turns into a fat cow...same thing, different gender

ArmyGruntJoe: Agreed, BUT Women are victimized by That Old B@stard Father Time who robs them of what Mother Nature gave them; Then it Is HRT Time or Bust. This is where Women get screwed, without HRT they can't get screwed. Women are the Victims, not the Perps When Essential Estrogen Harmones are taken away from Them, They get the Sh!t End of the Stick. Face It, They Have To.

My wife is cook, housekeeper, lover, caregiver to our grandchildren, and many other things. If that means that I go out to bring in a paycheck, then so be it; I am more than happy to do it. I will treasure her for the rest of my days. My eyes and my heart see past any of times little cruelties. She stood by me through a military career, deployments included, raising our children while I was far away, seeing to the home front, through thick and thin. Stuck by me during the transition to civilian life, when jobs were scarce and money tight, and is still there, right now, preparing for Christmas festivities. She is the world to me.

I think it's more to do with keeping the infrastructure in place, because they don't make money out of vaccinations. If there was no seasonal flu shot, they wouldn't keep the infrastructure in place for financial reasons, so when something like H1N1 comes along it would take much longer to create a vaccine in sufficient quantities. But the seasonal flu shot itself is usually not much help.

we have antipsychotics available too, for people with paranoia.

Some of the long term effects of the flu shots are the goal by the companies making them. If you take 2000-5000 IU of Vitamin D3 per day you will be protected from the flu with beneficial side effects. The only thing you will notice is that you will not be sick. The side effects of a flu shot sometimes is not immediately apparent. The problems of cancer and mercury can grind on your body for years to come. The flu shot is not properly tested because it's put out there by the guise of an 'emergency'.

FogOracle, thank you for preaching what I have been preaching for a long time on these forums.

Nice to see others 'get the big picture' and are not gobbling up the big pharma bullcrap they love to shove down the throats of potential clients.....

You are right, but calling H1N1 the swine flu is not politically correct. Lord Obama decreed that all governmental agencies refer to "that flu which shall not be named" as H1N1 back in 2009. I have no clue why he would do that though. Go figure.

The name was changed as it was not really "swine" flu. As I have been told by an infectious disease specialist there were 3 DNA types in this particular virus. Swine, bird and human; not an easy combination to find in nature. Jus' sayin'.

Obama was trying to make sure that politicians weren't referenced.

Swine flu epidemic = Congress in session

When the Swine flu came out there was a drop in the sales of pork products...even bacon. Bad for business...hence the name change.

They needed a shot of asteroid vaccine.

Bonzodog, dinosaurs lasted a long time, but individual species of dinosaurs didn't. Just as individual species of mammals, like Neanderthal Man didn't, even though mammals have been around since dinosaurs started.

People like you are the reason that mumps and whooping cough are starting to make inroads at returning to schools. People who do not vaccinate their children should be charged with child endangerment.

there is yet no evidence that the vaccinations work

and there is no evidence that you have any common sense.

I am just wondering what it is you think are the dangers of vaccinations? Is it slowing suffering w/ open wounds and starvation for air? Oh wait, that is Small pox. Is it choking on mucus and inability to breath in small children? Oh wait, that is Pertussis. Is it deformed bodies and chronic pain the rest of your life? Oh wait, that is Polio. Is it blisters all over your body and severe high fevers that can cause kidney failure? Oh wait that is Zosta virus, otherwise know as Chicken pox. Are you seeing a pattern here? Risk from vaccinations is minuscule compared to a world w/o them.

Einstein once said "Common sense is the collection of prejudices acquired by age eighteen."

Is it common sense that if you inject yourself with live viruses that you will prevent disease? Maybe not!

But it's true. Kamau5, overcome your "common sense." Quit making up facts. Be thoughtful who you choose to listen to. Oh, and get a flu shot.

You have to practice personal protection in around the public, it's that simple.

The risk posed by the flu is minuscule. The risk posed by big pharma and their cohorts in WHO is a serious danger.

People who do not vaccinate their children should be charged with child endangerment.

Good luck with that. Which pharmaceutical company do you work for? This is the same false propaganda what we have come to expect from Big Pharma. Simple numbers with no details. The devil is in the details.

Keep in mind - these are the same people that produce the medicines that keep millions of people alive and well. What would a diabetic do without the products these companies produce?

And - the risk of the flu is NOT minuscule - for thousands of people. It can and does kill people - some forms of the flu kill tens of thousands. Check out the swine flu in 1918.

Brickwall2

You must work for big pharma.

You must work for big pharma.

no, most of us are working for common sense and protection of the innocent from the ignorant. you can spout non-facts all day long, people, but it will never make it the truth. I wonder are you going to keep on denying when one of your loved ones is dying from a preventable disease? your child, your parent... or even you. too bad you'll be too dead then to come on to a message forum and tell everyone you were mistaken.

most of us are working for common sense and protection of the innocent from the ignorant

And Big Pharma loves you for it. Last year an investigation into the ECDC false H1N1 pandemic scandal was launched by the European Union. I guess common sense elludes that entire continent, huh?

There is acres of evidence that vaccinations work, look at the WHO website. Plus drug companies do not make significant profits out of vaccinations, compared to anything else they sell.

There was an episode of Penn & Teller's BS where they basically destroyed every argument against vaccinations comprehensively, I suggest you all watch it.

Perhaps you should do a little research on the backgrounds of the members of the WHO Board of Directors. Penn & Teller are very entertaining ... but I should think you could easilly do better for an informed opinion on impact of vaccination.

Where is the evidence that your immune system works?

Why is it that if someone is killed after getting a flu shot, the makers of the shot cannot be sued? Think about that a second and you will conclude that neither you or your family should be taking and experimental risk on this trash.

Where is the evidence that your immune system works?

It's in everyday life...you live in a world full of bacteria and viruses and you don't get sick. That's because your white blood cells target the invaders, destroy them, and get them out of your system before you feel the effects. To me, that is how you know your immune system works.

The reason you get vaccinated is because some invaders are so dangerous that they'll do permanent or fatal damage before the white blood cells can destroy and escort them out of your body. Meningitis kills quick. Mumps can leave you sterile. So even when the immune system finally rids your body of these toxins, you're left with the aftereffects. Hence, the vaccine that teaches your body how to produce antibodies to counter these invaders the minute they enter your body, so you feel no effect.

It's not rocket science.

good morning countrygirl....my grandmother died from the spanish influenza in 1918. She didn't have any immunity to it.

"At least we aren't dealing with the Black Death or the Spanish Infuenza."

Countrygirl, the scare about the H1N1 virus was exactly that its DNA profile closely resembled that of the Spanish influenza. In fact, tissue samples taken from people who survived the Spanish flu, when injected with H1N1 had developed antibodies, in other words "recognized" the virus. This was the very reason why the WHO jumped the gun and declared a pandemic. With a minor mutation this virus could become as deadly as the Spanish Flu.

Hey, who volunteered for that injection of H1N1? Where did they get the survivors? I thought Spanish flu was long gone. Did they know they were getting the virus?

Why are people so dead set against modern science, which has saved millions if not billions of lives?

If your child became diabetic, would you refuse to give him insulin? If he got pneumonia would you refuse to give him antibiotics?

What gives? Are we becoming a nation of Christian Scientists?

No Tina, unfortunately, we're becoming a nation of STUPID PEOPLE.

Halsgal4evr, the Spanish Flu epidemic hit the US in 1918-1919. The survivors would now be in their 90s, although some folks may have gotten that flu in the 1920s. My grandmother had the Spanish Flu in 1918, she's 98 and lost 3 brothers and a sister to it.

Well alrighty then.

Take 2000-5000 IU of vitamin D3 and go about your business.

Take it daily. I might add

This is a bad thing? I'd prefere 65, but all in all it sounds good to me.

It sounds good to you unless you are one of the ones who got a horrible illness and suffered unspeakably til you died.

Agreed

My mother grew up in Africa and became an RN there. No one got vaccines. No one died from measles, mumps, rubella, or chicken pox, either. She also never knew any old folks with senility or dementia. Cancer was exceedingly rare. Whenever it was discovered that a child had any of the aforementioned childhood illnesses, mothers sent their kids over to play and catch the disease. Naturally, they were otherwise healthy kids. They'd all be sick for a bit, but the result was that their immune systems were actually strengthened.

Later in life an American employer required her to receive a flu shot. It almost killed her. This, it was said, was impossible. 25 years later she was coerced into taking a flu shot again. She was extremely reticent, but acquiesced, reasoning that the viruses are now deactivated. The result was the same.

Don't flame me. I am not anti- all vaccines. But they do not all work as they were intended to. My kids' elementary school experienced a huge chickenpox outbreak. Because the vaccine didn't work, and the parents of vaccinated kids didn't look for symptoms and allowed their kids to infect others. Now there is a significant whooping cough outbreak. Again, kids who received the vaccine are both catching and spreading it.

It is simply foolish to either vilify all vaccines or to blindly label them panaceas. They should NOT be allowed to contain formaldehyde or aluminum. And NEWBORN babies should not be given four (or more!) vaccines at ONE TIME. Most parents won't even allow anyone to hold their new baby without first washing their hands. Yet they will inject pathogens into their bodies, and are led to believe that they are not PERMITTED to request ONE vaccine at a time.

Japan is one nation, with a health care system better than The United States', that bumped back the immunization schedule to begin at 2 years old.

Balance is required, but balance does not seem to be allowed in this discussion. Perhaps this is because in this country profit comes before public benefit in the drug companies' list of priorities.

Because of the money.Unless people actually think the government cares about them.

There's another important reason why everyone should get vaccinated against these diseases. Put on your Public Health Policy hat. For everyone who gets sick, they infect others. Vaccines don't just protect us as individuals, they keep us from contributing to epidemics.

And that's good for everybody.

Common

You should worry if you have a child that is younger than the minimum age to get the vaccinne. Pertussis is an example. It kills infants and you cannot effectively vaccinate an infant for pertussis.

You should worry if you have a child or grandmother who is immune deficient due to chemo and for whom the flu shot would not be effective. The flu for that them can be deadly.

Some people, for whatever reason, do not develop immunity from vaccinations. They are protected by something called herd immunity, where if more than 80% of the population is immunized, the disease has so little chance of entering the community that they are protected. People get upset because when people who can get vaccinations don't get them, it puts those who can't get vaccinated, or don't respond, in danger. Pertussis is an excellent example of herd immunity. Children can't get vaccinated against it until 6 weeks of age, their immune system isn't developed enought to respond to it. Pertussis is potentially deadly to newborns, as seen in Cali this summer. If all those around the infant are immunized against it, the chances of the baby getting it are almost nothing, as over 90% of pertussis transmission comes from caregivers. If you look up each vaccination at the CDC, it lists what % chance there is that you will not respond to it. I knew someone who had received a MMR 8 times and never built immunity to rubella. They were otherwise healthy, nothing wrong with their immune system, but get them around someone who didn't get vaccinated, and is infected, and they now have a high chance of getting that disease.

And most other disease too!Our bodies are extremely capable if treated right.

Except that your body's immune system isn't primed to handle invading bacteria and viruses right after birth. It takes time and energy to handle these diseases. When you're an infant, you want your child to expend energy to grow and remain healthy, not fight infection. The more exposure to disease, the less availability to make the other bodily functions work. You want a sick, immuno-compromised infant on life support, be my guest. But I want a healthy, growing child protected from disease. If you don't want to vaccinate, don't go to the hospital when your child is sick...why be hypocritical about it? You chose no preventive medicine after birth, so why should you inundate our medical facilities with your stupidity down the road when your baby gets sick from a preventable disease?

Kara

It sounds like you know many things that the rest of the world does not know. Can you let us know the location of Jimmy Hoffa? Thanks so much.

Like I said above, we have medications for paranoia, too,

I didnt make my sarcasm clear enough. Ive known several pediatricians very well. None of them have had a desire to hurt children. I dont think it is in big pharmas interest to hurt people either. This fringe anti vaccinne anti medical establishment people need to loosen their tin foil hats.

I will say this again. Those of you out there with the PhD and doctorate degrees have unfortunately been indoctrinated with some false information. I find it increasingly surprising that supposedly intellectual people are having a problem using logic and common sense to be able to properly investigate and research these issues. While tin foil hats may be helpful, for real protection you may want to situate yourself inside a Faraday cage.

I love how the "almighty FogOracle" knows the "truth" behind everything. Perhaps it's YOU that's been indoctrinated by Internet rumors and falsehoods, not the scientists and doctors that see their proof in the lives of saved patients.

I didn't say all the knowledge was wrong. I don't claim to know everything either. I'm saying those that seek to uphold their organizations and are willing to sacrifice their own personal ethics should realize that the model cannot be sustained. It will eventually crash.

IF what you think is correct actually is. What if you're wrong, however? If we seek to eliminate vaccines, and illnesses and death increase (as has been shown in small communities that resist vaccination), then the "crash" you will hear will be disease knocking at your door. Model can't be sustained? What are you talking about?

I find it increasingly surprising that supposedly intellectual people are having a problem using logic and common sense to be able to properly investigate and research these issues.

I love how it's only logical to think the way YOU do. If disease is reduced along with the use of vaccinations, then isn't it logical to get vaccinations to reduce the chance of disease? How is this NOT logical? How is it not logical that in communities where the vaccination level is reduced, there's more disease? If you hang your hat on conspiracy theories, at least follow through with it.

In said communities what are the results of nutritional deficiency? Might this have some bearing on anything? And along these lines, many 'deficiencies' are based on inaccurate levels dictated by many of the organizations that have a vested financial interest in vaccines and keeping nutrition levels below levels they should really be at. After all, I'm sure there are no doctors out there that would willingly disseminate false information to get finding from drug companies (oops seems I just read a big article about this very thing).

In said communities what are the results of nutritional deficiency?

There would be nothing out of the ordinary when it came to nutrition in these communities. Yet the disparity between their communities and the rest of the country, with the only changing variable being the reduced vaccination rates. To conclude that they're getting sick from not enough vitamins, especially Vitamin C (which is in everything nowadays in 100% daily doses), is ludicrous. Yes, Vitamin C helps keep the immune system in good shape, but by no means does it PREVENT diseases. Yes, vitamins help to maintain homeostasis in the body, but they're not going to prevent the effects of polio, measles, etc. from taking hold of your body.

Studies have shown that when people take vitamins, they're healthier. BUT...people who take vitamins daily are likely also to take better care of themselves, which begs the question of whether the vitamins cause the good health or is the vitamin intake part of a healthy person's normal routine? Much like the study that found that drinking diet soda makes you fat...it's not the diet soda making you fat, it's the fat making you turn to restricting yourself to diet soda.

Vitamins are good at keeping the body on an even-keel. But they don't help prevent disease. People who follow your logic and don't get immunized but drink plenty of OJ for Vitamin C, etc. are still going to get sick because their bodies lack the antibodies for the diseases...no amount of vitamins can give you antibodies.

This of course would apply to diseases like polio and measles in which the effects are bad...OJ can help fight off the common cold, but it won't prevent you from contracting polio, etc.

You might want to investigate this link on Vitamin D3 for fighting both cancer and influenza:

http://www.grc.com/health/vitamin-d.htm

There are only several vaccines that may be beneficial. The others induce toxic elements into the host causing a wide array of medical disorders. There is not adequate testing because they are released in a rushed panic. The makers are not held responsible for any lingering health problems. If you want to be a guinea pig, go for it.

You naturally produce antibodies because many of these 'diseases' are non-life-threatening if you have proper nutrition to begin with.

Since I started taking 2000 IU of vitamin D3 every day and eating organic foods and distilling my water, I have yet to be sick (this was several years ago). So, no amount of talking is going to convince me that what I'm doing is not making a difference in my health. I don't even get colds anymore.

After doing research in these areas, I have to conclude that the 'American Medical Machine' is severely broken. As well as the medical research and big pharmacology industries. By withholding real research on vitamins (or none being done in the first place) people remain in a malnourished state, which is an advantage to the 'American Medical Machine'.

There are only several vaccines that may be beneficial. The others induce toxic elements into the host causing a wide array of medical disorders.

Now you've gone off the deep end. Toxic elements? Only several are beneficial? How about meningitis vaccine that keeps college kids from dying when they get to school? How about tetanus vaccine which keeps you from contracting it when you scratch yourself on rusty surfaces? How about polio vaccine? C'mon, man. While I agree that the chickenpox vaccine is likely overkill, you can't say that the rest of them aren't beneficial.

You naturally produce antibodies because many of these 'diseases' are non-life-threatening if you have proper nutrition to begin with.

You obviously have no idea what happens in the body's immune system when you get sick, do you? Yes, you can create antibodies, but the body has to first get sick with the illness to do so. So with polio, you have to contract polio to have the body's immune response create antibodies. Do you really with to contract polio, measles, tetanus, meningitis, etc. just to create antibodies? If there were an AIDS vaccine, would you instead wish to contract AIDS just to create "natural" antibodies for it? Of course not. The reason you get vaccinated is so that the body creates antibodies (naturally, btw) against the viruses that would significantly hurt you if you contracted them in the natural world. With meningitis, you would get seriously injured or die before your body has the time to create antibodies and a system-wide immune response. So yes, your body would be able to create antibodies, but you imght be dead before it's able to do so. Do you really want to risk that? This is the whole concept of vaccines! Give your body the kickstart to produce these antibodies so when you do encounter them in the world your immune system can rid your body of the virus before it does you harm.

You're missing the entire point of vaccines. They prime your body for an immune response to illness (naturally, i.e. the body creates the antibodies, not the vaccine).

There is not adequate testing because they are released in a rushed panic.

Don't know where you got this, but it's false. Safety and efficacy studies are done over years before a vaccine is released to market. The H1N1 flu vaccine was tested for safety and efficacy long before the public even had its first confirmed case of the swine flu. Just because YOU didn't hear of it doesn't mean it was "rushed" and "not tested".

The makers are not held responsible for any lingering health problems.

Really? I thought the makers paid a fee to fund the vaccine court judgments for every dose of vaccine produced. Maybe it's all a conspiracy, right? Yikes. You are deluded. What's the point of vaccine court if not to be responsible for health problems potentially caused by vaccines? You're talking out of both sides of your mouth.

After doing research in these areas, I have to conclude that the 'American Medical Machine' is severely broken.

I highly doubt you've done research beyond the Internet, and to think that it wasn't biased in any way is simply ludicrous. You have an agenda, and to think that vitamins are the key to healthy living and will save you from any disease is preposterous. Just because you are healthy and take vitamins does not mean that they'll save you from disease. Sorry, that's not the way it works.

Since I started taking 2000 IU of vitamin D3 every day and eating organic foods and distilling my water, I have yet to be sick (this was several years ago).

And I eat prepared foods a lot, eat nothing that says "organic" b/c it's BS, drink tap water, keep up on vaccines, and keep in shape, I haven't gotten sick since food poisoning in college 10 years ago, and that was even from a piece of raw chicken that wasn't cooked properly by the restaurant. Anecdotes do not make good policy, sorry.

Finally, I love how you dislike the medical field and companies for "not performing real research on vitamins". You think it's a big conspiracy that's keeping the "wonder drug" of Vitamin D down? C'mon, man. You're deluded. While Vitamin D might be beneficial, it doesn't mean that vaccines and pharma drugs aren't beneficial, or that Vitamin D is going to prevent disease (if it did, wouldn't you expect some pharma company to incorporate it into a drug and make mega profits?). If it really was the end-all-be-all of medicine, we'd have known it by now.

I'm thinking you work in the medical field. How do you like being owned? How do you like not being able to say or do anything outside to controlled environment of your organization masters? You know as well as I do that any beneficial vitamins will never get the studies that are needed because they are not patentable and prices would not be able to be jacked up for profits. Everything I see tells me that big pahrma has invested substantially in drugs that do one thing beneficial and 10 things detrimental. In addition, there should be studies that include drug interaction because there is likely additional detrimental effects compounded intentionally in these cases. I have yet to see one manufactured drug that only does a good thing with no side effects. Yet, in nature, it's prevalent.

Wow, seriously? And vitamin companies like Nature Made, etc. don't reap huge profits? At least the pharma industry is regulated. Vitamins don't have to hold up to any standards or regulations.

Never get the studies? Really? So I must have missed all those commercials that say this vitamin does this, that vitamin does that, in clinical studies. Hmmm, you seem as though YOU are the one working in the vitamin industry.

Not patentable? For shame. If in one of these studies it was shown that a vitamin had an actual pharmacological effect, then it would be patentable. Much like other chemicals are patentable once they're shown to do something beneficial. Problem is that vitamins have done well in clinical studies, but in bigger studies they fail to markedly improve life.

I like vitamins, honestly. But don't make them out to be a disease-preventer, because they're not. If you say it helps your vitamin deficiencies, that's fine. But to say they'll prevent disease or provide valuable protection in place of vaccines or other drugs, that's dangerous and unfounded.

How do I like being "owned"? Same as you're "owned" by the vitamin manufacturing companies. I'm sure Vitamin Shoppe, GNC, and a bunch of other giant pill pushers are happy to know you think they're "the little guy". At least I know that the company I work for has drugs that help people prevent or recover from injury. The companies you love produce pills for profit without any marked benefit for human life, other than to replace vitamins we're supposed to be ingesting via our diet. OWNED!

Unfounded? That's exactly my point. If these companies don't want something proven, they can do that. They influence government regulators, doctors, and publications. They certainly have the money to get whatever they want.

If you'll notice the vitamin industry is being bought out by big pharma. The reason being that they want to hedge their bets. I have to laugh at all the commercials on TV when I hear about side effects of the drugs that are being pushed. I've also noticed that some supplement companies now have started including genetically modified substances in their supplements(corn oil,etc) and I wonder if these companies were bought out by big pharma?

They can't patent vitamin D3, resveratrol, or turmeric since they are all naturally occurring. All of these tend to provide multiple health benefits with no side effects. Since drug companies can't make a significant profit from them, as soon as there are promising studies, studies stop happening.

I do not work for vitamin or supplement companies. I do use vitamins and supplements and find them very beneficial to my health. There is no way to convince someone with propaganda when they have first hand experience with vitamins and supplements.

I agree that vitamins are beneficial, but again, to claim that they prevent disease, etc. is unfounded.

I have to laugh at all the commercials on TV when I hear about side effects of the drugs that are being pushed.

And vitamins don't have side effects? C'mon, get real. EVERY vitamin, supplement, drug, etc. has side effects. You take too much Vitamin D, you get hypercalcaemia (elevated calcium in the blood), which can induce nausea, kidney failure, anorexia, and if you're pregnant, mental retardation and other deformities in the fetus. No side effects? Come on.

I've also noticed that some supplement companies now have started including genetically modified substances in their supplements(corn oil,etc) and I wonder if these companies were bought out by big pharma?

Supplement companies aren't being bought by "big pharma". Pharma companies are regulated by the FDA, supplement companies are not. No pharma company is going to risk getting into an unregulated industry like that. Lies are unbecoming.

They can't patent vitamin D3, resveratrol, or turmeric since they are all naturally occurring.

No, they can't patent them because they have no pharmacological effect on the body. Again, nice try, but lying is not helping your cause. Lots of pharmaceutical drugs are naturally occurring. That doesn't mean you can't patent them.

All of these tend to provide multiple health benefits with no side effects.

You're deluded if you think vitamins have no side effects. I already gave you the side effects for Vitamin D. For resveratrol, side effects include diarrhea, stomach cramping, arthritis, joint pain, decreased appetite, blood thinning, anxiety, and headaches. For turmeric, side effects include gastrointestinal issues, uterine problems, nausea, diarrhea, etc.

Just because the label doesn't specify these side effects (because the supplement industry is unregulated) does NOT mean that there are no side effects.

Since drug companies can't make a significant profit from them, as soon as there are promising studies, studies stop happening.

Since they're not drug substances, THAT is why they're not made by pharma companies. And plenty of studies are done on these vitamins. Not only that, but you'd be surprised at the profits that GNC, Nature Made, etc. make on these vitamins.

It's amazing you don't work for these companies, as you're giving us their sales pitch almost verbatim!

Like I said before. They work for me. So, although you talk a good line, I've noticed you've provided no links to prove your position. You talk of taking too much of a vitamin can be bad. Look at how much Vitamin D3 it takes to be bad for you!

http://www.grc.com/health/vitamin-d.htm

That's right. I do have links to back up my position.

Here's a link showing how drug companies were busted giving cash to health advocacy groups. 160 health advocacy organizations received funding from Eli Lilly in the first half of 2007

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/01/14/health-advocacy-groups-ta_n_808866.html

So, let's see some of your links

Here's another link about how autism is still linked to vaccines, even though the mass media is being fed information otherwise.

http://www.naturalnews.com/031056_autism_vaccines.html

I absolutely LOVE your naturalnews story. It's so chock full of factual errors that it's beyond comprehension. Like this little nugget:

A January 10 Mail Online (UK) article entitled "Scientists fear MMR link to autism." reported a Wake Forest University (USA) medical study that found measles virus in 70 out of 82 autistic children tested. None of them were wild measles strains. They were all vaccine strains, common to MMR shots. This should at least exonerate Dr. Andrew Wakefield

So what they found was that (gasp!) the shot was administered to 70 out of 82 autistic children. The fact that virus strains were found in vaccinated children is nothing new...it's actually EXPECTED! But the article then states that the virus and vaccination caused the autism, which is false. I'd be more concerned with the 12 that DID NOT have the virus. How does this article claim they got autism? They don't address it, because it's counter to their skewed point of view.

Multiple examples of a one-sided "news" source drawing their own skewed conclusions from actual research. So they pick out bits and pieces from research and report it out-of-context to fit their point of view. And you call that a legitimate source? YIKES!

As for vitamins, you have a ridiculous point of view. To claim that they can't patent a vitamin because it's naturally occurring is ridiculous. Penicillin, insulin, and many other chemicals are naturally occurring too, yet they've had patents

There is no way to convince someone with propaganda when they have first hand experience with vitamins and supplements.

You said it perfectly. There's no way to convince a supplement user that what they take isn't helping them. A "perfect specimen" who takes vitamins and supplements will believe that those items he/she ingests are responsible for their good health, when in fact it could very well be the fact that they eat well, exercise, and take care of themselves that is the cause.

I love how you claim it's all a big conspiracy. Vitamins are classified as foods. You can't patent an orange or banana, so you can't patent a vitamin. Especially since your body needs these things because it can't get them solely from diet alone. The mark-up on these things would be ridiculous and monopolistic.

As for supplements...the problem I have with supplements is that they're unregulated. They could be mixing cement with your creatine, etc. and you'd never know and they'd never be caught. No one's watching the farm. Which is why pharma drugs are safer than supplements any day of the week. I'll guarantee your supplements are made in a dirty warehouse with few environmental controls...why waste money on controls and new machinery when the industry can make a killing by charging you 40 bucks a bottle for a useless supplement and pocketing the profits? I laugh at your ignorance.

Next time don't get your news from "naturalnews" and other skewed points of view. You've got to wonder about the websites you peruse...yikes. And you call me "owned"? You're giving all your money to companies that don't provide a benefit to you. HAHAHAHAHA...you're the one that's "owned", my friend.