So you are saying that obesity doesn't cause diabetes? It is at least a contributing factor. I'm not a medical expert, but some forms of diabetes are genetic, but some are caused by poor lifestyle choices like overeating.

People are becoming fat and out of shape in this country and are already a burden on the health care system.

If they can determine what cause the diabetes, then tax it if it's not a genetic condition. Smoking? Tax it! Obesity? Tax it by the pound!

The article states that the extra fee is not for having diabetes, but for having diabetes and failing to make an effort to lose weight. Sounds like if you are diabetic but within an acceptable weight range, you would not be charged the fee.

I think it is reasonable to charge people extra who are not taking reasonable care of themselves and as a result are costing us all more. Of course the devil is in the details ... how this would be implemented in a fair manner.

So todd where does it stop?

Natural Red Head with the normal fair skin that goes with it.. Ouch they got 3rd degree sunburns, and needed to goto the emergency room...they should of known better... Tax em

Black Americans are more likely to have specific diseases... Tax them..

Unprotected sex leads to unwanted children and can spread disease.. So if you are found to be having sex without protection.. Tax em.

Eating excess of red meat can be bad for your health, so if you eat more then X ammount.. MORE TAXES for you.

Eating too much salt, blah blah blah

Yes I know these examples are " out there " but they prove a point.

I don't think I've ever read a case about 3rd degree sunburn in my life, please show me a link to it.

Todd-Type I (Juvenile) diabetes is genetic. Type II (Adult Onset) is usually caused by bad diet and lack of exercise. I agree taxing those with type II diabetes who don't take care of their bodies. Type I is a little different however, as most type I diabetes contract the disease very early on in life and should not be taxed 40 or 50 years later because their body isn't as strong as it once was.

Jeremy-960164

funny.....Love it!

Problem with charging more for people on Medicaid is not logical...

If they HAD the money, $50 extra, they wouldn't be using Medicaid....

Unfortunately, cheaper food is comprised of starch, sugar, salt & fat.

Empty calories.

Might be more merciful to either treat the disease, or just "put em' down" (as they say at Animal Control).... hapless souls....

Or maybe Jan Brewer (with her connections to those Corporations who now operate Prisons in Arizona), could set up barbed-wire-enclosures designated as "Fat Farm" or "Smoker's Sanctuary"....That would teach 'em....no food or cigarettes allowed.

By the way, excess drinking & drug use also leads to illness...why aren't those "sins" included along with Fatso & Smoker?

Obesity? Tax it by the pound!

So, what are we looking at in terms of your proposed "tax it by the pound" philosophy?

Are we looking to use the completely useless BMI to determine who is obese, you know like:

• Lou Farrigno (6'5", 316lbs, BMI: 37.5...OBESE)
• Arnold Schwarzenegger (6'2, 250lbs, BMI: 32.1...OBESE)
• Lee Haney (5'11", 260lbs, BMI: 36.3...OBESE)
• Dwayne Johnson "The Rock" (6'6", 275lbs, BMI: 31.8...OBESE)

http://www.nhlbisupport.com/bmi/

Pretty much every single athlete that holds any amount of solid muscle is considered overweight or obese...so...while I understand a desire to tax people by weight, I think the first thing we need to understand is that a lb <> lb when it comes to health.

This is part of that new smaller government the GOP wants. Soon they will be telling when you can shlt.

Should probably be taxed by body fat percentage instead.

As for poor people only being able to afford crappy food - B.S.

It costs about $60 a week for my wife and I to eat balanced meals. Chicken, pork loin, pork chops, the occasional steak. Throw in sweet potatoes, brown rice, whole grain pasta and a freeze stuffed full of frozen veggies and eating is VERY cheap. Tasty too if you have the know how and a well stocked spice cabinet.

Added benefit - we'll never get hit with the fat tax eating this way!

Tood, Obviously my comments went right over your head.

though I expected as much.

They need to tax the tea partiers too. They are always mad about something and high blood pressure leads to higher medical costs...

Just get illegals to pay their rightful share and they wouldn't have to come up with crazy taxes to pay for the "too much" government we already have...

we'll never get hit with the fat tax eating this way!

The other problem is that people think that only "fattening foods" will get them fat. You can just as easily down thousands of calories in steak, chicken, rice, and potatoes...body builders do it all the time. If one doesn't exercise, they'll gain mass amounts of weight as the stored carbs turn to fat.

Again, not saying that YOU do, but there are those that believe, "sugar gets me fat and steak, chicken, and rice will keep me thin"...and it's not really that cut and dry.

First of all, taxing individuals directly for such things cannot be done without violating countless constitutional rights.

These kinds of invasions on individuals were actually discussed more than 200 years ago by the Framers of the Constitution concerning how government(s) may equitably ENCOURAGE individuals into certain desirable behaviors without beating them over the head by using inequitable oppressive punishments to force them into submission to the State -- in other words, tax the pizza, NOT the individual. Taxing the objects of consumption naturally avoids encroachment into personal and private matters, and PRESERVES freedom of choice while at the same time protecting against personal and private oppression.

Furthermore, such a tax directly on individuals will simply cause people to not seek medical attention, out of fear of being punished if the Doctor (or some other official or professional that is in league with the State) finds something that (s)he, under such a repugnant law, is required to tattle about to the State.

Type I diabetes is genetic and due to a damaged pancreas, insulin receptors, or the body immune system attacking the much needed insulin. This is beyond a persons control and there is no known cure. Type II diabetes is normally due to poor diet control and the pancreas inability to pump enough insulin to support the large body. For type II, there is a potential cure....proper diet and excecise. There is difference and the two can be determined by a healthcare provder.

No one is telling you what to eat or how much but if you choose to down McDonalds everyday and wind up diabetic and obese, then it shouldn't be the tax payers responsibility. Hospitals are subsidized by our tax dollars and if you need to go to the well more often because of YOUR choices, than you should ante up a little extra.

For OhNo. Hard to get illegals to "pay their fair share" when the response to finding one is going to be jail them for being in the state illegally and then boot them out. I don't see that making a decent amount of money. Or, what happens when you find one that didn't know they were illegal until they were an adult, went to college, and would come out with a high paying job that will be taxed quite nicely? Uh oh time to boot that one out but keep the welfare citizens in... Wouldn't it be better to give that one citizenship and then have them pay their fair share of taxes which will be higher then the inbred citizen trailer trash collecting welfare from the state? If Arizona wanted to fix their budget problems they would have been far better off trying to tax those there illegally instead of now paying the cost of jailing them and trying to find them....

So if you're over wieght, diabetic and smoke is the tax $150 or do you get a tax break if you're a 'three fer'?

I guess the fact that insurance companies already charge you up the wazoo, if they will carry you at all, doesn't provide enough incentive based on Arizona's thinking.

Pretty soon people will think I am trolling this message but I seem to find the SAME argument on EVERY thread!

Choo-choo! All aboard the right/left extremist train!

I don't think busting out the whiskey and singing Kumbaya will do us any good...?

A Veteran, here is a link regarding 3rd degree sunburn. I believe you requested one? Coming from a very redheaded girl!

www.emedicinal.com/diseases/sunburn.php

--A Veteran

I don't think I've ever read a case about 3rd degree sunburn in my life, please show me a link to it.

I don't have a link to my Dr.'s photos he took of me 20 years ago but I did have a 3rd degree sunburn. The worst burn of any kind my dermatologist had ever seen and he was 2 blocks from the beach!! So Sir I think you need to think again about your comment, IT DOES HAPPEN!!

Carolyn I don't know where you get the "potential cure" fact from, but I dare you to tell that to a diabetic to his /her face. I am a type II diabetic, 45 years old, 5'9 175lbs and my BMI is 25.8... that is considered overweight believe it or not. I wear size 34 pants and not tight either. I was athletic all my life, and while in the US NAVY, I was a buff 185lbs (and my waist size was 30 back then). Diet and exercise you say? My father used to be a boxer and NEVER overweight. Let me tell you something about what diabetes has done to me. When I was diagnosed with diabetes in 2003, my doctor suspected that I had been a diabetic for at least 5 years (that would have put me at 33 years old; only 5 years removed from my end of military service). I played sports, even umpired softball, coached basketball and used to run 5 miles a day. I cant do those things anymore because after my diabetic onset, I developed neuropathy (look it up and read about it). Just like there is NO cure for diabetes (yes, it can be controlled with diet and exercise), there is no cure for neuroapthy either. The pain is so severe that there are days when I cant even get out of bed, much less exercise or do the sports that I so much enjoyed in my youth... usually with diabetes, there are other issues. I will agree that people should take better care of themselves and try to avoid foods that will make their diabetes worse, and exercise is something that wont kill anyone, but it's not always that easy, or that black and white. So before you make a statement like that, think about what you say, because it doesn't always apply, and generalizing this issue, can get someone upset, and God forbid that you get kicked in the butt because you didnt know how to control your mouth...

The weight and diabetes taxes are a little questionable. People can be over weight through no fault if their own, such as those with thyroid problems. I do not see anything unreasonable in charging an extra tax on smokers. This is something that definitely is detrimental to your health and is entirely within your control. It also does not have any subjective component to it, like eating too much fatty foods or too much salt. Who would define what is too much. Also, too much for one person might be perfectly OK for another.

well good thing you have your navy and government benefits to fall back on. but lost of people help advance their medical problems with bad choices. sorry if yours was natural but i think the article is aimed towards the people that abuse themselves and ask others to pick up the tab for their bad choices.

overeating, smoking, poor diet, exercise even if you eat right, drugs ect.

Both Diabetes are genetic. Type I can also be caused by illness or immune system problems.

If type II was just caused by obesity then every fat person with a bad diet would get it. You have to be genetically predisposed to have problems and be heavy.

That being said, type II people should be doing things to keep it under control, a tax isn't out of the question; people need the motivation.

So people that are purchasing and using legal products like cigarettes and fatty foods should have to pay more taxes. Let's see, I helped pay for two pro sport stadiums and an arena with smoking and drinking. They then kept this sin tax after the ten years it was supposed to be in effect.

A pack of cigarettes is about 1.00 for the smoke and 4-5 dollars in taxes. Where is this money going? How about putting taxes on Pepsi and Coke and all fatty foods. Who would make the determination and what criteria? How can you be sure you are taxing all smokers and obese people? What about people who have gained significant weight not because of over eating but because of medications they are required to take? It happens.

How about an unplanned pregnancy tax? Who is deciding what lifestyle choices are taxable? Live your life like a whore and that's okay but have a Big Mac and pay a tax.

Here is a great idea. Let's open the books in all these government offices and make sure they are getting the most for our already paid tax dollars. Let's force "all" government workers, politicians included, to actually work and put that tax money to good use.

Here is why I find this offensive. I smoke and used to drink more than I do now but also kept myself in shape. I see a doctor once every couple of years or so. I have never had any major medical problems in my 45 years of existence yet I am being judged based on what I choose to do legally. If I become a burden to the system in my later years, as even the perfect person could, I have been paying into the system for the last 30 years and have at least another 20 more to go----if I am able to retire. I have not taken anything from the system and would deserve my fifty years of taxes coming back to me.

There is no absolute accountability in spending the tax money. It's an open checkbook. A money tree. We will never run out even when crooked politicians and big corporations marry each other, what can go wrong? We haven't seen any bubbles burst. Well, except for the tech bubble and the housing bubble, not to mention the energy Enron bubble.

Here is a great idea. Why don't we bring back all the labor jobs that were lost overseas. That would be 40 hours a week that people can't eat or smoke and the labor can be good exercise. As a bonus we collect all that extra payroll tax to fund our bloated system.

Jumping off my soapbox to think outside the box.

Give up a pack of smokes a day and a dozen Krispy Kremes and you can afford the extra $50 for Medicare, a gym membership, and some cool looking new clothes for your thinner, healthier body.

And for those who ride motorcycles without a PROPER helmet (not those to get around the code that provide little or no protection) because it is their "right"? They can pay the head trauma/brain injury component of their hospital bills.

I want to tax everyone who eats or does anything that I DON'T DO!

I hate fried chicken...... and it leads to heart disease..... TAX EM'!

I don't like to golf, and it causes a worthless increase in consumption of fuel which in turn pollutes the air we breath, leading to medicare payments for lung disease (traveling to the course) and electricity (golf carts) it is also a waste of precious land resources and impacts the environment and through that, all of us......... TAX EM'!

Private swimming pools waste precious water resources as watering the lawn and washing the car does. It causes an increase in our water costs and impacts us all..... TAX EM'!

I have type 2 diabetes and am not fat .... I have followed doctors orders, exercise and have lost weight, but still am classified as type 2 diabetic .... WTF ? So I should be taxed based on my health on top of everyting else ?

Smoking and being grossly overweight, fine. Diabetes is more problematic, not all caused by lifestyle choices. But it is time for people who choose to make foolish lifestyle choices to start paying their share of the bill. I am sick and tired of paying higher and higher premiums for people who choose to eat junk food, smoke and put their genitals in places they don't belong or copulate with multiple partners like a bunch of dogs. Enough is enough. And if you don't think that is where much of your premiums go, then you'd better get informed. Go Arizona, make people who do stupid things pay. Then go after the fraud and frivolous law suits and cut off medical benefits other than life threatening emergencies (having babies is not usually life threatening) for illegals and health care would be affordable for all again.

And only 50.00 for smoking?? Make it 500.00 a year.

By the way...... most of you people who are supporting these STUPID taxes, don't know anymore about diabetes and heart disease, than you do about fornicating.

THEY ARE BOTH GENETIC...... Type 1 known as child onset, and Type 2 which is dormant and appears in later years. Type 1 can be triggered by something as simple as a child suffering a traumatic incident (death of a loved one or severe injury). Type 2 can be brought on at younger ages by becoming obese, but isn't always the triggering mechanism.

LEARN SOMETHING BEFORE YOU STICK YOUR FOOT IN YOUR MOUTH. And there was great success being made several years back on a cure for type 1 diabetes, using an embryonic cell injected straight into the pancreas. But that research got killed by do-gooding bible thumpers and right-wingers. It seems they would much rather see those embryos thrown away than save some persons life.

36 years in the medical profession, 18delta, EMT, MT, AMT

I'm sorry, I must have missed the part about the fee for drinkers who destroy their kidneys, pancreas... Just more proof of taxation WITHOUT representation. Why do Republicans hate America so much?

There is a major problem here on which no one has commented.

Medicaid program is considering adding a $50 tax on single patients who smoke, have diabetes or are overweight.

Why is it right to punish single patients, no matter what the illness might be (smoking, overweight, etc.) but not hold people who are not single accountable to the same standards?

The article goes on to state:

The gradual reduction in enrollment — which would mostly affect childless adults — is about half of the enrollment rollback that Brewer previously included in her budget proposal for implementation later this year.

It is absolute discrimination to consider eliminating anyone from health care based on marital status. What about all the 300 pound couples walking around Walmart with six fat kids? Single people and singles without children already pay for schools for those fat kids and get no benefit in return. Why are they now going to lose health care coverage while those fat parents retain coverage at the same time that they are teaching their kids terrible dietary habits.

On another note, there are countless people with Type II diabetes who have never been overweight a day in their lives. It's called genetics. No one can control the genes inherited from one's parents.

Finally, to those of you who are so critical of people who are overweight or have some other unhealthy lifestyle habit...take a good long look in the mirror. You might think that you are perfect, but chances are that you also have an equally unhealthy vice, such as consuming too much alcohol, salt, fats, etc. You don't have to be overweight to live an unhealthy lifestyle. When it catches up to you and begins to cost you extra money to pay your medical bills, you'll sing a different tune.

fornicating is genetic??? Only in your imagination

Hahahhahaha good one. You actually believe they were referring to martial status or did I miss the sarcasm? LOL!

What? 3106699

That is what "Mountain"53 thought, and your name on here is EXACTLY, what I thought, when I read his reply!

Charge every woman with more than 2 children $100.00 per child semi-annually. This should cut down on a few million dollars a year, if not more.

Can't feed em, don't breed em!

Shadowofself53.... Don't breed em', don't have future men and women for the military unless you are wanting more immigration into our country to fill the ranks?

Somehow, I just seem to get the feeling that you'd be against having our armed forces filled with "legal" immigrants.

The smoker pays more than $50 in taxes from the purchase of cigarettes. Most of them in one month. The money from the taxes on those cigarettes pay for many things in your state including to help pay for educating your kids. I wish they would just outlaw cigarettes and spread the tax burden from the loss of revenue.....put it right on top a gallon of gas. Make it a fair burden on everyone. Either that or use the taxes generated from the sale of tobacco products to be used for smoking related illnesses only.

And it's on the Honor System !!

Do you smoke ??

Cough, Cough, NO, cough, cough

ok...next question....

________________________________

6 months later..." But you tested positive for Nicotine this visit"

Cough, cough....yeah....Nicotine, cough, patches....uhhhh hem...

Do e-cigs count ???

Steve....I had (the operative word here is HAD) type 2 Diabetes. The only reason I had it was the fact that I was morbidly obese. I weighed 627 pounds in 2001. I went and had a gastric bypass and went on a strict diet and exercise and I not only lost my weight I am no longer Diabetic!

experts found that the bypass surgery fixed the diabetes (before the total weight loss). an unintended unexpected consequence.

Aceyourpapi "Carolyn I don't know where you get the "potential cure" fact from, but I dare you to tell that to a diabetic to his /her face."

Have you ever watched The Biggest Loser? Pretty much every season, nearly all of them start with Diabetes (or pre-diabetic) and by the end of the show have lost the weight, and VOILA (like magic) their diabetes too. If thats not FACTS, then I dont know what facts are.

"I am a type II diabetic, 45 years old, 5'9 175lbs and my BMI is 25.8... that is considered overweight believe it or not. I wear size 34 pants and not tight either. I was athletic all my life, and while in the US NAVY, I was a buff 185lbs (and my waist size was 30 back then)."

So, let me understand - in the navy, you were heavier - but more FIT...now, you're lighter...but less fit? Do you know what that means? You're muscle turned to FAT. so, yes, you are overweight...believe it or not.

"Diet and exercise you say? My father used to be a boxer and NEVER overweight. Let me tell you something about what diabetes has done to me."

Why did you add that bit about your dad?

"When I was diagnosed with diabetes in 2003, my doctor suspected that I had been a diabetic for at least 5 years (that would have put me at 33 years old; only 5 years removed from my end of military service)."

I cant help but wonder, how much were you drinking during your stint in the Navy? You do know that Diabetes is caused by excessing drinking, right?

"I played sports, even umpired softball, coached basketball and used to run 5 miles a day. I cant do those things anymore because after my diabetic onset, I developed neuropathy (look it up and read about it). Just like there is NO cure for diabetes (yes, it can be controlled with diet and exercise), there is no cure for neuroapthy either."

I think you seem to think all "diabetes" is the same, and it simply isnt...because WE arent all the same. Many people DO cure their diabetes, simply by losing weight - and becoming fit through exercise - and never get it back again. Others, not so much. You, I dont know you personally so I cant speculate on what sort of lifestyle choices have contributed (note, I didnt say CAUSED) your diabetes. But, I do know that as humans - we tend to ignore our direct impact on things, and simply fixate on the one little tiniest part we know we cant control - and pretend THAT controls everything, why even bother right? You have diabetes, it cant be beaten...right?

"The pain is so severe that there are days when I cant even get out of bed, much less exercise or do the sports that I so much enjoyed in my youth... usually with diabetes, there are other issues. I will agree that people should take better care of themselves and try to avoid foods that will make their diabetes worse, and exercise is something that wont kill anyone, but it's not always that easy, or that black and white."

but excuses, are oh so convienent. and im not beating up on you buddy, cuz ive been there...done that, I have my own issues that I contribute too and try to pretend like I dont...so im speaking from experience, and you're tipping your hat to the things you know you failed on...while also insisting, your situation isnt as bad as it is because of those things you failed on...its everything else, ya know, all the stuff beyond your control...right?

"So before you make a statement like that, think about what you say, because it doesn't always apply, and generalizing this issue, can get someone upset, and God forbid that you get kicked in the butt because you didnt know how to control your mouth..."

You should take your own advice, because what he said IS factual for MANY people. apparently, not you...right? but, dont take offense...he clearly, obviously, wasnt talking to YOU. the only way he was talking to you, is if you fit into the group of folks who have failed to take care of themselves - with or without having a crutch called a disease.

My partner has MS - there's far less known about its causes and impacts, and yet...we've paid as close attention to her body as possible so that we can attempt to understand, if only for us, what we can do to help it - versus hurt it. Diet, Exercise, Stress reduction...all of those things greatly improve her health, and though at times difficult to keep in check, it is always within our capability...its just not always the choice we make. Sometimes, we fail to stay active and in shape, and that affects her. sometimes we fail to eat healthy for periods of a time, and that affects her...and sometimes we fail to dig deep enough to stomp out the stress and relax...and it affects her. but i'll never ever tell you that there's nothing we can do, that the disease has the control. we, you and I, already know better than that. so everything else IS just excuses.

Obama better stay out of AZ or it will cost him $100.00 bucks.

So Jessica you work in the medical field. You have helped treat people with diabetes and you know that just by loosing weight bam you are cured. You are so wrong. I have worked in the field for a long while. Sometimes weight loss helps and sometimes there are other contributing factors that cause the diabetes and people have no control over it. It is just like cholesterol. Many times you do not find out until later in life that you have hypercholesterolemia and it can be controlled with diet at times but other times it cannot. I know severe diabetics that are in great shape and do everything they are supposed to and yet there are times where their diabetes goes out of control. People also get diabetic peripheral neuropathy which makes it painful to move thus creating a problem with movement. Until diabetes comes under control many times the patient sleeps a lot again causing a problem with exercise. So there are many contributing factors. Sometimes just being a diabetic and being "brittle" causes problems with getting up and getting moving thus causing weight gain. And who is going to say what qualifies as "overweight"?

Comment 1.29 raises a good point, how many people here even read the article. Nobody is getting taxed by the pound or by disease, they are actually having to pay a little back for taking up resources which they received under medicaid, resources to help them improve their lives and which other people also need access to, yet not putting in the effort themselves.

"People who are obese or chronically ill, and those who smoke, would need to work with a primary-care physician to develop a plan to help them lose weight and otherwise improve their health. Patients who don't meet specified goals would be required to pay the $50 under the proposal."

If you don't want to pay back a little of the benefits you received under medicaid, then maybe you need to put in some effort to improve yourself instead of waiting for physicians to do it all for you. There is already a shortage of doctors and will get worse under Obamacare so this is long overdue.

Personally I think anyone who habitually visits the doctor for self imposed conditions should pay full price plus a "No effort" penalty anytime a doctor can determine that they obviously have not taken any effort to follow his recommendations.

I'm confused as to why these "fees would apply only to certain childless adults". Presumably it is fine with the political freaks in Arizona if you weigh 600 pounds and chain-smoke filterless Camels - as long as you have children to whom you can pass along your talents. Way to build that Republican teabagger base!

People already pay more for insurance if they are a smoker and hopefully they will smarten up and quit. What I know about diabetes is it shouldn't matter what type you have and as to being obese, maybe if people earned enough money they could buy healthy foods.How many obese rich people do you know. Your Governor needs to go NOW, people in Arizona need to smarten up about their politicians.

We could be the first country on earth with a fatso tax . Whoooo Hooo the USA rocks !!

leave it to the brainwashed liberals to defend over eaters. i have no problem with this tax if arizona does it right. refrain from deploying this as a blanket. tax those people who don't have diabetes. the people who choose to be overweight by being lazy and eating too much. we all can agree that being obese is bad for your health so why shouldn't people who could fix their own problems not have more incentive to do just that?

tax this tax that tax this tax that. Its all apart of the grand scheme of the poli (TICS) ians. Who want's control of this oversight comittee?

Gotta say, if you excercise daily you can keep your self healthy.

Eating balanced meals does the trick. Even with Diabetes, or obesity, (which may or may not cure diabetes in some cases) Is still a better choice for the overall health of your body.

I am not saying go out and do the Gold's Gym power work out. Just take a 2 mile walk (outside of your work day and normal life) every day for a few months, and see how much better you feel afterwards.

Yes if you have not worked out since high school, or have been lax in your daily excercise it may hurt the first week, even the second week, but the following weeks you will find those simple daily tasks have become much easier.

You might want to change your diet, to less calories in each sitting, 4 small meals (300 calories or so) instead of 2 or 3 meals of 800-1000 calories would keep your body more energized as the nutrients would effectively be used as you need them and not be stored as fat for later consumption.

Used Brains,

Uh ... Sarah Palin was the one that defended people's right to be fat.

Michelle Obama was the one that said lose weight.

I just love Arizona. Glad I own property there. The list for those to pay more for Gubment healthcare need to be expanded to include:

- anyone without a verifiable and valid SS#

- anyone with tatoos including non-English words

- anyone who drives a car that sits low with skinny tires

- anyone who eats tacos more than 3 times a week

- anyone who can't speak fluent English

- anyone who hangs out in parking lot at Home Depot

- anyone who hangs out in hospital emergency rooms without an emergency

- anyone who needs public school teachers who do not speak English

- anyone with a car but no insurance

Sounds like a good start.

NOT a good idea.

as one person already stated, "Problem with charging more for people on Medicaid is not logical...If they HAD the money, $50 extra, they wouldn't be using Medicaid....Unfortunately, cheaper food is comprised of starch, sugar, salt & fat."

My grandmother is diabetic. My father is diabetic. I had what is commonly referred to as Pregnancy or Gestational Diabetes during my pregnancy. So I made as many changes as possible to not only my own eating habits but my family as well. Then I lost my job as the recession hit. BANG. No extra money meant buying the cheapest healthiest foods possible.

Normal folks eat bread. Diabetes are allowed 1 slice per day! Sugar free bread costs TWICE the cost of a regular basic loaf of bread. Sugar vs Splenda? THREE times the cost to buy Splenda for use in family meals and drinks like tea. Sugar is way cheaper. Go check the stores for sugar free alternatives and you will find regular items are way cheaper while diabetic items are double to triple the cost of the regular item. When on a limited pay check or no pay check at all, diabetics can't afford the diabetic alternative foods. Pickles with "no sugar added" cost twice the price of regular pickles.

Now what has gotten me mad over this since realizing this is that most of our diabetics are senior citizens on limited income. So we penalize them for being poor and being diabetic by allowing this type of thinking and laws to pass.

As for the over weight comments--who determines what is over weight? Who determines what is healthy? Healthy and over weight is not so very easy to determine when something like diabetes hits. If a person works, they don't always have time for more than a short work out. Some of us have to work harder than others to maintain a weight. Can't wait to see some of you get old and how fat you get. I fight it daily but know by looking at my family that one day I will gain to the point of being called fat-not all fat people are lazy. Some just don't have a metabolism that works as well as others. Some of the "fatsos" in my family walk and exercise daily for little to no benefit of weight loss."

Hey, Alphabet Soup!

I eat tacos more than 3 times a week - sometimes.

I belong in America - I'm white.

Hey FringeD , Bitter about your weight there big boy ? Better break out the ole checkbook . lololoooloolol

Do you even know what diabetes is?

The cost of all of these conditions broght on by smoking and being overweight is GROSSLY outweighed by the amount of money spent treating non-citizens. I see a slippery slope where specific individuals are singled out - "certain non-married individuals?" subject to the ban. Why not charge illegals $100,000.00 for every instance they are caught using our health-care system? Of course we should let them know up-front, and ahead of time, that the charges are coming so they can plan accordingly to make alternate health care plans if they elect not to pay the "get-the-freak-out" surcharge. In Europe they charge familiies in excess of $10,000 per year per child to use the school system; another money-loser!

They are working on that too,

http://www.azleg.gov/legtext/50leg/1r/summary/s.1611approp.doc.htm

I would not be averse to this tax, if and only if, it applied to every citizen of Arizona. To single out the poor, well, that's just so GOP, isn't it?

It seems prudent to me to tax all the smokers in the state, and I've seen the video of that fat fart who wrote the immigration law; he should be taxed, for sure!

I agree. Everybody in AZ should be subjected to the $50 fee. The Fat legislators should be taxed; are they exempt? If the legislator smokes does he pay the tax?

Is AZ the most backwards state in the union?

To GreedyCapitalist: Shame on you. I guess you are the model of health. You realize that there are juvenile diabetics, who are born with it? That it can be genetically transferred from mother (pregnant) to baby?

How ignorant you are!

Come on now McCain is a hero. He spent a lot of time as a POW. Bad food in those camps. Certainly he can be allowed to gain a few pounds.

Seems to me that smokers spend $50+ in cigarettes per year anyways. I have 'zero' problem with them paying $50 extra for medical insurance. Smoking is an optional things anyways, just don't smoke. And don't cry to me that your choice of having started got you addicted. Don't start, period. If you did start, pay the $50 or find a way to stop.

The overweight and diabetic thing however is dangerously close to crossing the line.

Go, Sally! I hate it when people are so insulting! Thanks for doing your job!

Most people who are overweight aren't that way by preference. You will find that many who are Clinically Obese eat a lot less that some of those skinny folks. Some people overeat as part of a coping mechanism because of Traumatic Stress. There is no one answer that Fat People are Bad, Stupid, Lazy or any other pejorative you want to use.

Many low income people are overweight because they can't afford really high quality lean food, so they tend to eat cheep food with a lot of carbohydrates ( Rice, Beans and Sugar), and cheep protein (High Fat Ground Beef, Cheese). These are the lowest cost commodities you find in a super market. This would be a hugely regressive tax.

LOL

NOW Cass Suntein is "Nudging" their "chubby Progressives , and they don't like it !

Welcome !

To everybody that smokes , owns a v-8 engine , speaks their mind , likes McDonald french fry's ...etc etc etc

Amen!

We could also charge Tepco $5,000 per American for the widespread fallout that will lead to a further increase in cancers while we're at it.

I already pay higher taxes for my cigarettes, to the tune of about $2.00 a pack. I do NOT see overweight people paying higher taxes for their junk food nor do I see alcoholics paying extra taxes for their booze.

And we could also send out the overweight among us to disconnect the nuclear generated power from the Gendolkari's of the world. That would amount to some serious weight loss, and much less American Idol watching and web blogging by those who want to utilize only "green power".

dom, most states tax alcoholic beverages, some a pretty significant amount.

Instead of taxing the people directly, the state should add more taxes to the individual products that people buy that are signifigant contributers to these problems (Tobacco products, alcoholic drinks, Fast Food). I agree with the above poster that if we start to tax people on an individual medical basis where will they stop.

Of course the state will never tax the products themselves, then they would have no lobbist giving them money or vacations homes to change legislation away from the people's needs to their needs.

And also tax anybody dumb enough to go out and get a 3rd degree sunburn.

Personal responsibility? Would leave very few people not being fined and would certainly not exclude many politicians. Every time that I read articles like this all I can think of is Matthew 25:40. May God have mercy on us all.

Arizona Health Care Cost Containment program spokeswoman Monica Coury says the tax is intended to push patients to take better care of themselves.

That quote made me laugh. HCR is not so bad after all. Let's see get some insurance or lose some tax dollars or follow the AZ plan, either way you will be taxed for being a pig and a chain smoker.

BTW: Obesity causes a lot more health problem that we want to admit. It's a horrible plague on this country. We have to get fit!

Cigarettes had a .50 per pack tax put on them years ago by Arizona to pay for smokers health care. As soon as the money started to be substantial (it didn't take long), everyone and their brother was carrying around a petition trying to get some of that money because there was SOOOOO much of it they couldn't stand to see it just sitting there, waiting. If you start taxing other things, the same thing will happen, there will just be another wonderful cause to use all that money on. Look at the Social Security tax for another example.

Instead of finding ways to charge more, reduce expenses. That's what people have to do that don't have enough money coming in to cover outgo.

funny how everyone wants everyone else to pay more taxes but not themselves. Just like a lot of people on newsvine think everyone is lazy or stupid but not themselves. Or that you just work so much harder than everyone else and deserve everything you get. Everyone complaining about what public employees get in benefits but somehow forgets that when someone buys their companies products or services the customer pays for their benefits. When did we become such a bunch of throw the other motherf----- under the bus society. Really sad commentary on us that we are ready to start throwing people out of the lifeboat already. This is exactly what Hitler wanted to do in Germany. Survival of the fittest. When do we start gassing the handicapped? How about a minimum corporate tax so GE actually pays something instead of getting a 3.3 billion dollar credit for the very mess they created!

Instead of taxing the people directly, the state should add more taxes to the individual products that people buy that are signifigant contributers to these problems (Tobacco products, alcoholic drinks, Fast Food).

Chris, Why tax the products? They didn't cause the issue, the person eating/smoking that crap did. See, people have choices. With your suggestion, everyone pays for the individuals that can't/won't take charge of their lifes. So, your suggestion puts us right back where were at, pawning off an individual unhealthy choice on all those of us who take care of ourselves.

If you tax the products then you only get one solution, money to help offset the medicare expenses of Az. However, if you tax the responsible individual, you get two solutions; (1) offset the medicare expenses and (2) motivate/change the individuals over all health.

Let's place the burden on those that are actually responsible for their own health.

P.S. - And I have hypothyroidism (which will increase ones weight) but hit the gym at least three times a week

This could cause dissension within the teaparty ranks.

"Yes, it is possible to be a smoker and a runner, as unlikely as that seems."

I smoke also, but I also work out five times a week for at least forty-five minutes at a time, mixing aerobics and weight training. My blood pressure and heart rate are both normal; I'm considered to be underweight; and I haven't been to the doctor in about three years. You *can* be a smoker and still engage in a healthy lifestyle.

You'd be surprised how many cases of type 2 diabetes are caused by drugs that damage the pancreas and induce type 2 diabetes. I had a bacterial blood infection, was given super high doses of steriod based drugs in the emergency room and during inpatient care, and now I have type 2 diabetes. I had recently lost more than 100lbs in an effort to live a healthier lifestyle. A year long regiment of life saving drugs gave me diabetes and caused more than 50 lbs in weight gain. Where would I fall under your plan to penalize the obese, when I never had type II until being treated for a condition that was in no way connected to my body size or eating habits?

And how much will these geniuses spend figuring out each person's liability. They should start by passing a retard tax on the lawmakers. Balanced budget!

While that all sounds good, it isn't. Why should I have to pay even more taxes for smoking - I already pay for your welfare check with every pack I buy.

I (as a lot of smokers do) have my own insurance that I pay for out of my pocket. So why should I pay more taxes again? So you can have more free trips to the ER for that splinter? Get out of here.

The diabetes tax should only go on top of the fat tax AND if the A1C is too high. That should protect the type 1's who cant do much about it.

So, for dom and others. Something to consider. Smoking causes a lot of problems after many many years of use. You will appear healthy while smoking and working out but there are several things smoking does to you that working out will not be able to fix no matter how healthy you are right now or later. The most dangerous one is the accumulation of radioactive isotopes in pockets in the lungs. One of the main culprits is Polonium 210, a radioactive alpha emitter. This isotope will accumulate in localized pockets in your lungs. This can expose small sections of your lung to rather intensive amounts of radiation for very long periods of time. Your lungs don't really have good mechanisms for removing this substance so it keeps accumulating causing higher and higher doses of radiation. This high amount of radiation does sever damage to the genetic makeup of your lung cells causing all sorts of localized mutations. These mutation occur regardless of how healthy the rest of your body is.

http://www.webspawner.com/users/radioactivetobacco/index.html

Secondly, even while healthy, your body is fighting off cancerous cells. Your body is actually very very effective at finding cancerous cells and eliminating them from your skin, blood, and other tissues. However, lung tissue that is exposed to radiation and becomes tumorous overcomes your bodies ability to defend against it regardless of often you work out or exercise. At this point, you can be healthy everywhere else but have a malignant tumor that spread to other areas of the lungs. At that point, you're healthy as an ox, but you have a malignant tumor growth that will eventually spread to the rest of your lungs and to other parts of the body.

This is why you often find completely healthy people that exercises regularly but still develops lung cancer from smoking.

Devil's Son:

This is exactly what Hitler wanted to do in Germany. Survival of the fittest.

I think you're thinking of another gentleman by the name of Charles Darwin

You are a pompus ignorant putz that knows nothing what soever acout smoking or achohol abuse. The fact is that people use these products that are legal and after adiction pious punkd like yourself try to dump on then. You are already getting your pound of flesh from the $4.00 a pack tax for cigs and who knows about the booze taxes.

soccermomtoo, I feel ya. Drugs for rheumatoid arthritis did the same thing to me, the weight gain anyway. Went from 145 to 205 in two years without even trying, I had always been tall and skinny. The only thing that has helped me lose 25 pounds is that RA can also cause a serious appetite decrease. So, I am basically losing weight in a seriously unhealthy manner. That can't be good for me. Eventually, because of this disease, I will be forced to go on disability and Medicare. Good times.

lilywhite-- there is no fee for those who are unable to control obesity, such as a result of their medical treatments. the fees they are talking about are for the people whose lifestyle choices are the cause of their medical conditions. and they are right, the majority should not have to pay extra just because I want to smoke myself into lung and heart disease, or because I want to eat so much sugary fatty refined foods that I eat my way to a heart attack or an embolism.

dom, grow up! Smoking is a choice, plain and simple. If you don't buy cigarettes, you won't pay the higher tax-is that simple enough for you?

This law seems like a good idea on the surface but would be very hard to implement fairly. People who have inherited diseases obviously shouldn't be penalized for something they had no control over, whether it's diabetes, obesity, etc.

That being said, I have said for a long time that for conditions caused purely by choices made, higher premiums should be charged for their insurance. This is why I can't understand the opposition to the HCR law: it provides for covered wellness checks at no cost so that people can be made aware of potential health issues and head them off before they require expensive treatments. The Rethugs mock the health care bill but seemingly have no problem going to the ER on the public dime. The HCR law forces personal responsibility onto individuals. I think the law should go a step further and allow people not to purchase health insurance if they sign a waiver forfeiting all paid-for medical care for a given period of time, say 1 year. They would get one shot annually to get a policy-if they don't, so be it but they better not whine when they're diagnosed with cancer and accrue bills of $50,000 a month after declining coverage.

Both of my Grandmothers were diabetic. One was a little overweight, one would have blown away in a stiff breeze. My father was diagnosed in his late 50's though still active, jogging and playing tennis 4-5 days a week. I was fit, within my prescribed weight range, teaching dance and dancing competitively when I was diagnosed a decade ago.

The first symptom I had was the neuropathy in my feet. There goes most forms of exercise, not only jogging, hiking and dancing, but also things like free weights, since you can't risk injuring your feet, because they just don't heal consistently.

Some of the medicines for diabetes also encourage weight gain. While I'm off them now, they added to the pounds I put on in the first years and they're still there. When you're diabetic, you can't do any extreme calorie restriction. High enough blood sugar kills you eventually, low enough blood sugar can kill you today.

The fact that a propensity for diabetes can be aggravated by weight issues is not the same as diabetes being deserved because it's God's punishment for being fat and lazy.

So are you retards trying to say we only get cancer from smoking? Don't get it from contaminated water supplies, preservatives in food, just smokers? I pay more than my fair share of taxes, as a smoker I pay a lot more than YOU. So get off your high horse, go to the bars, have some drinks, drive home and shower. You stink of hypocrasy.

ALCOHOLISM and ADDICTION are DISEASES you dumba**es! Hope you or someone you love deals with it and you will realize it. Grow up, read more and quit with the stupidity.

Comment removed by Author.

This could cause dissension within the teaparty ranks.

Thought the same thing, lib50. This makes the soda tax look like a joke! And look at the amount of cash the Koch brothers dropped on ads against that. LOL!

Here's a thought: hop on a state-monitored treadmill that is hooked up to a capacitor, then to the grid. For every kW-h you generate, the state will remove some of the surcharge. Takes care of obesity, idleness that leads to obesity, and dependence on fossil fuels and nuclear energy.

+1 to Greedy Capitalist. Type2 is caused by overconsumption of fat, sugary foods and cheap crappy refined flours. Hmmm, I just described a value meal!

Its time we tax the stuff that will kill you and use the tax to pay to keep you alive. THAT is what national health care should be. Then, preventative medicine will become so affordable, you only need insurance for real emergencies, like transplants.

Funny, you'd be surprised how many slender or just barely 'heavy' people out there suffer from diabetes. I worked at a pharmacy, I knew plenty! Some people try hard, and their body does work against them. My mom, I watch her struggle, she does what she is told and the weight doesn't budge but the medicine they put her on makes her unable to function properly. I think it's wrong to charge $50 to people who suffer from diabetes. Some are BORN with the disease. Shameful.

Wow. So our beloved right wing idiot governor finds that big government in our lives and in healthcare is okay as long as it prods the poorest and weakest of us all to do what she wants... all in the name of fixing budgets. Besides being pathetic, she's being seriously hypocritical in soooo many ways! Somehow this doesn't surprise me at all.

So I guess it costs nothing to regulate, track, judge, then report on EVERYONE on medicaid to weed out the failing ones (based on who's judgement?) to enact a $50 a year fine? What a joke. No savings here. Just Republican Ridiculousizm at its finest.

Can you guys kick the down-trodden any harder?

You know, in reality, those that smoke and eat badly die sooner and require much less long term care... which saves us money. So maybe we should pay them $50 a year to die earlier than the rest. Don't tell the gov. She'd jump on that one.

@Julie re #2.13,

I believe Chris (re #2.6) has the better argument. Also read Jo's comment at #1.16. Or you can look at what NYC is doing to encourage New Yorkers to live a healthier lifestyle while reducing medical costs due to smoking and poor eating habits.

For example, cigarettes in New York City will cost you anywhere from $10.00 to $15.00 +/pack. Clearly the high price is a result of high taxes on tobacco products. Now couple the high price of a pack of cigarette with a ban on smoking in restaurants, bars, etc. and you'll see many smokers encouraged or forced to quit smoking. And that's a good thing.

Or let's look at it this way: Let's say you're a pizza lover and a slice costs $2.00. If the price went up to $7.00/slice, you’re going to gradually stop eating pizza. Of course it would be ridicules to raise the price of food three fold to encourage people to live a healthier lifestyle. But it would be reasonable and attainable to convince makers of, let's say, fatty foods to substitute corn oil with something healthier to cook with.

Now put all these things together, add bicycle lanes to encourage people to ride a bike - and exercise - and before you know it people will be on their way to a healthier lifestyle.

Julie - you are smart as a box or rocks. Darwin didn't invent "survival of the fittest" you moron.

First of all, Herbert Spencer made that quote after reading Darwin's" Principles of Biology" and was comparing economic theories with biological ones.

Second, that catchphrase is a simplified synonym for natural selection.

Nobody "invents" physical processes. That is completely asinine. They are discovered and understood.

To the guy who made the incoherent claim that Hitler wanted "survival of the fittest". Same thing. I suggest you pick up "The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich" by William Shirer and learn history.

But way to invoke Godwin's law dude.

Mr Greedy, where are you getting your facts?

You sound like one of those for profit prison owners who thrives on the illness of others. Haven't you heard: drug and alcohol abuse is a disease and unlike some types of diabetes they all can be cured with the right medical attention.

LMarkT: "You know, in reality, those that smoke and eat badly die sooner and require much less long term care... which saves us money."

Are you freakin kidding me?? Show me where in the 'literature' you found the facts supporting this? I work in health care and these people do not die sooner. Modern healthcare keeps them alive with frequent doctor and hospital visits and many more medications, costly tests and procedures.

@GreedyCapitalist

If we can only tax you and people like you on your stupidity then we wouldn't be in debt anymore.

Cigarette smokers irritate the crap out of me! They are rude and inconsiderate - will smoke right in your face and could careless if it causes you problems. I think every establishment should be required by law to be smoke free - not provide an area that is smoke free.

Those smokers should be required to pay at least 25 or 30 dollars a pack for cigarettes and if they are able to afford them - they must smoke outside and also be forced to pay a hefty pollution tax!

I don't care how they find the smokers - just find them and charge them! It should not be too hard - they all smell like a walking cigarette anyway - it's in their skin - or just look at their nicotine stained fingers!

Call me Hitler - I don't care! I have just about had enough with these smokers and subjecting everyone to their second hand smoke. That alone is killing off a crap load of people!

thats how i feel about PROGRESSIVELY sticking scissors , into the base of a baby's skull....

think i'll have a cigarette ,(Like KING OBIMBO) ... instead !

STexan, I guess you missed my point entirely. Oh well. :P

Segdirb, you make a valid point.

Smokers should keep their habit out of other peoples' faces, but so should obese people, alcoholics, drug users, religious zealots, etc. I think that would mean most people would have to stay in their houses.

Give all the fat people the confiscated meth and crack saves it from having to be destroyed and helps the fat people lose weight fast

jgplol, I don't know if there's enough places around America that really need that much meticulous cleaning done. lol

Cuz they're the only group not designated a political victim group, silly boy. When's the last time you ever heard a politician trying to protect singles?

No, bs detector, they're talking about not taxing people who meet the criteria on family plans since the cost is already significantly higher than for a single.

It's like they don't have anything else better to do, but to make life harder for others, than it already is. Why is this such a big deal now? Oh yeah, because the cost of health care is going overboard, so we must judge those people unfit, and take out our frustrations on them. It sure is nice, to be able to set back and judge other people lives, and be high in grace. Makes me all warm and fuzzy inside to be a part of the human race................as long as I don't turn my back to them that is. I wonder how many people who are for this, have relatives who are in that boat? I also wonder if they would stand back and watch others throw them under a bus, just to save themselves a few dollars?

This is a BS attempt to get more tax dollars period. Tax a person for smoking? Are you serious?

Where is the tax for drinking and other over indulgence? Where is the tax for drinking soda? Where is the tax for eating M&Ms? Any sugar at all?

I still want to know where you people think all those tax dollars are going to come from when no one is left smoking and then ask yourself why they never include alcohol in the equation.

Indagroove: Darn right! Where is the tax for being at least as butt ugly and stupid as Arizona's esteemed(?) governor?

@Indagroove re #3.4,

You’ve just described the unavoidable and naked truth. The heavier government taxes smokers the fewer smokers there will be. We all suppose that's a good thing...at least while there are still smokers that will fork over the increase in taxes.

Now let's say that cigarette smoking has decreased by 50%. Assuming that 15% of the new tax revenue is actually allocated to its root cause, that's 35% less in tax revenue that government relies on to fix roads, subsidize public transportation, offset the increase in gasoline prices, etc.

In the end, a sizable portion of the revenue that will be generated by these taxes (should it ever become law) will be allocated to projects that are not part of the reasons given to implement this would-be-law. So, the reasons given to enact this law will only see a small fraction of the proceeds.

The taxes won't force them all to be healthier but it will help pay for the costs :)

True, and if a progressive tax that penalizes wealth, hard work, risks, and high levels of responsibility, and massive education costs is OK, then I guess this tax that penalizes excess weight is perfectly acceptable as well. Where do I sign up to endorse the bill?

I think we should add a tax on ammunition because bullets cause lots of expenses too. I see a pattern here - but some of you might not like where it leads.

STexan

I don't think $50 year tax is going to make a nicotine addict give up cigs...

That's not the aim of the tax. The tax is not to push people into living a healthier lifestyle, it's to make them pay their share because according to officials, they are straining the system due to their lifestyle choices.

$50 a year won't even touch "their share". Start with $50 a week or month and you may put a dent in it.

Yes Rebecca, and let's start charging $50 a week for those who drive, because of the pollutants their vehicles put into the air that make us sick. Or, how about charging everyone $50 a week, just because we can? That sounds pretty fair, doesn't it? Let's all just sign over our paychecks to the health industry, because there is no end in sight to the rising costs of it.

ok, if $50 isn't enough then how much? $150???

All you have to ask is WHY THE COSTS ARE SO D$^% HIGH!

You can stay at a 5 star hotel with all services for about $350 to $500 a night. A stay in a beat down hospital in the middle of nowhere will cost $10,000 to $25,000 a night. WHY?

Tax the products (more) if going this route - that will also "motivate people to be more healthy." It would cost well more than $50 per person to spend payroll determining who needs to pay the tax, who deserves exemptions (thyroid problem for example), phone calls from people complaining / looking for exemptions, fixing errors, people suing for genetic obesity beyond their control, etc., etc, etc..

I smoke, and have been to the doctor twice in three years. Never hit my deductible though, so I have to pay everything out of my pocket. What you are saying is that I should pay more for what might happen to me in the future? I believe everyone that has kids should owe me money for the unfair burden you put on the healthcare system. Even better, you should pay an extra 50 dollars for every kid you have. See a gynocologist? Its a choice, an extra 50 for that too. Dentists? Another 50. Its all a choice, so pay up.

@what_the_81 re #4.4,

That's not the aim of the tax. The tax is not to push people into living a healthier lifestyle, it's to make them pay their share because according to officials, they are straining the system due to their lifestyle choices.

The true purpose of this particular tax is NOT to "make them pay their share", but to generate revenue for a cash-strapped state in dire need funds. A tax truly designed to encourage people to live a healthier life will have far greater and better results in managing the spiraling nationwide health care cost.

Or we could just get rid of Medicaid all together for those that smoke or are obese? Maybe if the obese smokers have to foot the bill for their own medical care then maybe they'll think about changing their habits. Its easy to ignore your healthcare costs when its someone elses dime.

Obesity is a CHOICE unless you have a documented and measurable medical condition (i.e.hypothyroidism). Smoking is a CHOICE. The two combined probably contribute the most to driving up healthcare costs (hence the tax for only obesity and smoking) Medicaid is a handout for needy individuals. The least you can do is to try to avoid being a drain on the system.

And if people would pay more attention while driving, there would be fewer accidents, and the cost of health care wouldn`t cost as much. So, how do we judge who is a bad driver Leo, or may become a bad driver in the future, so we can place higher taxes on them?

I am so glad to read from all the saints on this board. Everyone seems to take such good care of themselves.

I will agree to pay my $50.00 tax as soon as it is enacted for all alcohol also. I have seen in my family and others a larger extent of health care costs due to alcohol than smoking.

But the article did say the tax on diabetics would be for diabetics that failed to keep their weight at a reasonable level, not on all diabetics.

You are right about people not knowing the standards..

I am 6 foot 4 and 230 lbs.. The Dr and BMI have said I am obese.. In everyone NOT in the medical field, I look good now quite a bit better then when I was 180 lbs that the BMI Index says I should be.

Would you consider someone like Brock Lesner from the UFC overweight or Obese? How about someone like Chuck Liddel? They are built, and according to the BMI Index overweight and or obese...

Do we start taxing fat doctors and nurses also? Believe me, there are a few of them out here also.

I want to be there when some beaurocrat tells liddell and Lesner they are obese

Good point ... across the nation, if states and federal dollars that are spent and could be saved paying for the education and healthcare of the illegal, anti-American, pro-Mexican among us, most budget shortfalls could be wiped clean instantly, just that simply and easily. If this opinion makes me a racist, then fine, I'm a racist, but then that makes those claiming I'm racist are anti-American and pro anything that is a drag on America.

Stexan ... it doesn't make you a racist ... it just makes you a practical capitalist!

If the government really wanted to cut cost then they would begin by cutting Medicaid and Education services to non citizens and additionally aid to countries that really in the end hate America.

What do you mean "go after illegals"? From what I am seeing, Washington wants the whole country here before the 2012 elections.

how can a human being be illegal in a free country. you ancestors are the intruders, stealing and murdering the indigenous natives. arizona was mexico before before it became a right wing hell hole

STexan- you are just another blithering idiot spouting off. as far as these taxes, they will wind up just like the tobacco taxes increased years ago- diverted somewhere other than where they were supposed to be spent.

They use a great deal of those taxe sto subsidize tobacco growers. Can you spell John Boehner? Shocking isn't it?

Hear, hear!

I sure do love being a Texan!!!

Here in Texas, because we have a sales tax (instead of an income tax), our illegal Mexicans are taxpaying Texans! (Not Americans, because they don't pay taxes to the Feds, just to the state).

They have every right to our indigent care here, because they help pay for it. They have every right to our school system, because they help pay for it.

To say that illegal aliens are a drain on our (state) economy and (state) government is completely ignorant and more than a little racist, Stexan. Here's a hint, you don't like them here because they're brown. I personally don't like them here because they don't speak English and I think it's rude of them not to learn, but you, Stexan, you're racist. Let's be honest here, the illegal Mexicans contribute more to our economy than our recent wave of black immigration (at least here in Houston) after hurricane Katrina.

Here's a story along those lines...

I was sent to Austin to set up shelters for the Red Cross during Rita. The first shelter we opened was mostly was Blacks and Whites and getting volunteers for the "guest" was next to impossible. As the storm got closer I was sent over to run a shelter made up of 90%+ Hispanics and I didn't have to ask for volunteers, as soon as they got settled in they were coming to me asking what they could do to help. After the shelter was closed we received a letter from the school we had been using thanking us for taking such good care of the place. Like I told them it wasn't us, it was the people staying there.

As far a language I found that most attempted to communicate in English but it is harder for older people to learn, all the kids spoke both languages fluently.

This isn't a Brewer thing - this is the Medicaid office. I don't think Brewer would sign such a law. This is being reported because someone somewhere in Arizona mentioned it. There was nothing in the article that stated that Brewer was in favor of anything other than reducing the number of people on Medicaid.

This IS a Brewer thing. Read the article. Brewer is asking HHS for their help in implementing her plan.

this is not a brewer thing, az is almost as bad off as ca regarding the state being broke, az is one of the top 3 hardest hit states regarding foreclosures. the people who still have jobs, paying out of pocket for there own health coverage and there familys simply cannot with stand any more tax hikes to enable the state to cover more medicad participents. this tax is only for childless adults who do not take care and follow doctors orders regarding the diabetes, not for type 1. IF I WERE A MEDICAD participent i would be hit with the smoking tax, currently, i pay more now on my health coverage because i do choose to smoke. so whats the difference? my life insurance policy is also higher due to smoking. az does offer assistance for quiting, im just not there yet, so, I PAY MORE. but i schouldent have to keep paying more for other people.

i believe smokers are the rudist @!$%#s in the world and should be forced to smoke only in closets where there stench does not pollute the world. yes tax them to the point they stop smoking

Well, if its really about making money, why stop there. How about a fine for politically correct too normal people. That is a much larger population. How about a fine for everyone that f@rts in public?

Ah, Mexicans ARE Americans. Really! I'm not making this up. Look on a map for Christ's sake. Just because you are obese and live in North America doesn't mean that you are the *only* Americans. You are just the obese Americans who are the loudest and most war mongering.

Alcohol sales are taxed in most states, some substantially.

And as far as the effects beyond health effects - which I am not debating - since what we are talking about here is health insurance, it would be inappropriate to charge in a health premium for anything except health effects.

Computer Geek

You are right about the alcohol. I just read on the local news site that at 9:30 this morning, yes, 9:30 this morning, some drunk crossed the center line on a road a couple miles from here. Put an 83 year old couple in the hospital. He is in there too, but you can bet that the elderly couple got the worst of it.

yes tax drunks into becoming sober as well, and actually enforce drunken bullies with jail time with a few new friends, then they might stop

Update to #10.2

One of the innocent victims has passed. The husband.

I'm not suggesting that taxing alcohol would prevent these things from happening. I am merely agreeing with Computer Geeks sentiment that it has a great cost to society.

That is an interesting point...

The Republican't Party wants less government, yet they want to tax people who are disabled and middle class and poor. They want to regulate everything that People do. They want to control what people eat, watch on television, read, and hear on the radio. The Republican't Corporate Teaparty wants to take away freedoms from women and hit them with massive regulations telling them what they can and cannot do, The Republican'ts and fundamentalist want to tell women how they can live their lives (SP).

WOW, so many regulations for a Republican't party that wants less government.

Funny how the Republican't party can be so hypocritical (Sorry for the spelling)

indeed, the republican mantra is: i got mine screw you, but wait you have something i dont have, no fair, legislate it away from you

Can you post up a receipt that shows how you've "paid" for fat smokers? Thanks.

You wouldn't even be thinking about paying for the healthcare of people who enjoy eating or smoking if you weren't paying for all the people who prefer to work the system rather than getting a job. I'm talking about parents putting kids on SSI to pay the for rent, alcohol, drugs. I'm talking about people having a platoon of children just to collect more taxes and qualify for more taxpayer-funded programs so they don't have to work. You want to talk about responsibility? Personal health is none of anyone else's business when you compare it to fraud.

There is a Valid Point if they are going to start this Tumbleweed!

Let's charge the mentally handicapped too!

and while you're at it any other group of individuals who don't live up to YOUR standards as well? wait I get now... going to eat that hot dog and have a beer at the game??? well we're going to charge you more for that.. you know you shouldn't eat that.... at what ponit of running other's lives does it stop????????

Before they attempt to "punish" those who they feel are behaving imporperly they should go through the system and get rid of the abuses and waste first... oh, and those double dipping top administrator salaries too!

And there are already excessive taxes on "sin" products such as alcohol and cigarettes.. a pack of cigarettes costs $1 to make... and $7 to buy.... um... what's the gov't doing with those $6???

Yes, let`s just charge all handicapped people while we`re at it. Let`s just tax each other to death, just because we`re humans.

Wow, tax the handicap. Never thought about that. Mostly if the cause of their condition was due to a human choice. As in sports, driving a car recklessly, hang gliding, white water rafting, name your choice here.

Tax kids from 16 to 26 every year to offset the health costs due to reckless or inexperienced drivers.

Tax people who buy 3D televisions since they may cause eye problems in the long run.

All it will take is a report to say something is bad and then tax it if this passes. Crazy but true.

charlton heston gave us the answer to old, fat, sick, drunk people. Soylent Green

Uh, are you serious? i don't know where you shop, but I've seen MORE than my fair share of people on food stamps with shopping carts laden with steaks, pop, lobster (yes, lobster), chips, frozen pizza...all totaling upwards of several hundreds of dollars. SWIPE goes the card and its all paid for by Uncle Sam. Hot dogs and ramen noodles are what college students and people like ME live on, who work for a living and pay their own bills and have to have a food budget.

justdontgetit: you are so right. I constantly see people's carts over flowing and SWIPE goes the card. I've seen shrimp, lobsters, scallops. Isn't nice they can afford a clam bake.

So because you eat garbage, every one else should too? That's ridiculous. Who's telling you to eat trash? Maybe you should take care of yourself instead of complaining about what other people are doing?

You also show how little you understand how food stamps work. Food stamps is not an unlimited resource for people who are using them. It's a fixed amount. Thus, if they are racking up "several hundred dollars" in one market visit, then likely that's all they have for the month.

It's no wonder that you justdontgetit.

Prejean...if you can read, which is doubtful based on your comments, I eat cheap foods because I have other bills that need to be taken care of each month, such as rent, car payment, insurance, and student loans. I was being slightly facetious; I budget accordingly so I can feed myself well, and for the most part the ramen and hot dog days were left behind in college.

Many people on food stamps have NO job, NO rent (section 8 housing), NO bills because their utilities are covered by local programs, and NO insurance because they get medicare. They have NO idea how to budget because someone loads money onto their "freedom card" every month for unemployment and food.

And I am well aware that food stamps are a limited resource, but I also know that their food budgets are generally much larger than mine, and that these same people shop twice a month and get this amount of crap food, because myself and people I know have worked directly with them before in the checkout stands. Trust me when I tell you that these people are not budgeting their food stamps for the whole month with their carts full of pizzas and cases of pop, because even the best food planner cannot make 15 frozen pizzas and 5 steaks feed a family 3 meals a day for a month. When you're spending someone elses money, its hard to care where its going.

Why don't you ask someone on food stamps what their food budget is monthly and then get back to us with your findings...I am betting you would be surprised at what you find out.

My boyfriend and I were receiving food stamps until recently. We do NOT buy lobster, and in general, you sound like a privileged jackass who has never met a poor person in your life. We pay our rent (no section 8), utilities, and he has a student job and is going to school, and I am a freelancer who is having trouble getting work these days and is trying to get a "real job". We tried to eat healthy and shopped at our local co-op, but the food stamps never lasted until the end of the month that way.

We were fortunate in that we could see it as a supplement, and that his mom could come down and get us a few things until the next month. She can't help him pay for school, so she helps with things like groceries when she can. My dad also gets us plenty of meat, since he's a meat cutter, so we always have a freezer full of chicken breasts and pork chops. Most folks on food stamps don't have those resources, so they have to eat cheaply. What they get on their cards for the month is it. They have children to feed, whereas we don't.

In a couple months, he will be graduating and *hopefully* he'll get a job right away. He's got an excellent chance to get a fairly high paying entry-level job at Target corporate. He can then pay back into the system, but we'll still be forever grateful for the assistance we received. THAT'S what the programs are for. The vast majority of people on food stamps ARE working, but they are either not making enough to support themselves and their families, they are only able to work part time, or they are working and attending school in order to better themselves and make themselves more useful to society.

(p.s. He and I have been together for nearly four years and would be married, but we are too poor right now to waste our money on something so frivolous, especially when we were having to accept government assistance.)

I live paycheck to paycheck and certainly am not a privileged jackass...and note that I said MANY, not ALL people on food stamps. So don't everyone get up in arms. The scenario I originally posted about is NOT unique. I've seen it played out in several different states (Illinois, Florida, and Maryland to name a few) and I've seen these same people bring their carts out to Cadillacs, which they can afford because the government pays all the rest of their bills.

I'm not saying this is the case all the time, but in my experience what we need is less money going towards food stamps and more people being responsible for their own health and not relying on the government.

Worked at a gas station in college where prices on "food" are high to begin with. Was surprised to see a lot of food stamps. That is when I learned you could buy candy, soda, chips, etc... with food stamps. Completely blew my mind and still does.

These same people had (real) money for the beer and cigarettes too. Later found out this was coming from state and federal checks they cashed. Hoping the system has been revised since 1994 so welfare money isn't being spent on junk food, alcohol, cigarettes, and illegal drugs (freedom card fixed???) but I doubt it.

Nope, if you can eat it or drink it and it isn't hot, foodstamps will buy it.

indeed and if they dont stop, soylent green

you know its funny, when i was on foodstamps i never had a problem keeping food in the house all month long and i did eat steak and healthy food, but now that i dont qaulify for food stamps between all the bills and child care i only have enough money to provide break fast for one entire week, lunch for one entire week, and if im lucky i have enough noodles and hot dogs left in the the house to make it till the end of one month when i get to do it all over again. after the bills i have 100 dollars a month for food. and i do do any thing extra, i live in a neighborhood where they wont deliver pizza after drk, and i live 2 blocks from work... btw i make a decent amount above minimum wage

First of all, no, I see normal looking people where I live. Sure, some could shed some weight. Some could stand to gain some. You have no idea why the "fat" people you see are. Perhaps they are battling some other ailment and are on steriods. I hope you never have to be on them because you gain weight like crazy while trying to save your life. Think about that the next time you see a "fat" person.

I am not saying that 300lbs/400lbs is acceptable. Please. The issue is the term obese and my point is a lot more of us are probably in that catagory than you may think.

Also, you don't have to be dangerously skinny and near death to be an anorexic or bulemic. Some are thin and probably told they could be a model. However the effects of their disease is destroying their body from the inside out even though you may not see it on the outside.

karen carpenter, the greatest voice ever, died of anorexia. but she didnt cost us anything

Ashley have you ever gone anywhere else besides ARIZONA,people like you wounder why when you go to someone elses country why you get no respect its the things they read about you white people,you all treat people like @!$%# and expect people to treat you all like what, think about it. PS people have CNN all over the world now you know, its not like in the 1960,s anymore.

This article isn't about government inserting itself into the lives of innocent bystanders. This article is about people who have signed up for government health insurance--that carries no premiums or costs for them---and making choices that makes them more of a burden financially than the taxpayers can afford. If they don't like the $50 cost of the healthcare, then they are welcome to purchase their own policy.

No premiums or cost to them? I'm sorry, I thought fatties and smokers all had the same tax rates deducted from their paychecks over the course of their working life? If the government is going to take a certain percentage of my paycheck specifically for healthcare (without giving me any chance to opt out), every penny of it should be used towards paying my healthcare when it's time to collect. I guess it's like social security though, "Oh, hey, a few people didn't seem to use theirs, let's spend the "extra" elsewhere...."

As others have said, I thought smokers and fatties were penalized through all of the exorbent tax rates placed on cigarettes and "junk" food. Don't the politicians justify those hikes every year with making up for the healthcare costs? I guess they just wanted to line their pockets and fund their pet projects instead.

And I don't buy the whole, "everybody will use healthcare eventually in their life" crud. There are plenty of people in the rural areas of our country that from birth to death, have not or will never see a doctor nor ever care to. I know it's a hard concept for those of you that run to the emergency room everytime you sneeze.

oppie - you showed your ignorance so quickly. Cigarette smokers should be paying $100 a pack because in the end we all pay for their care when they die and it does not end there. They throw their filtered butts on the road and pollute our environment for thousands of years. They throw their butts out the window and start fires that cost big money and even kill people. Smoking should be outlawed - it is a filthy habit that almost every one of them would like to quit. I don't have a problem with any of the "sin taxes" because if we are talking about personal responsibility why shouldn't people pay for what they do to themselves. And if the junk foods were not so cheap (pricing them on what they really should cost based on how they "kill" people) people would eat better and medical costs will go down. Let's do this - give every CITIZEN in this country the same exact health insurance - which a deduction would be made from every paycheck to pay for this. Take the people from useless insurance companies (all of them) and give them all new jobs as health coach's (get them in shape first) and require people to be healthy or they pay more for their deduction for health coverage. We would not need Viagara or a ton of other drugs or hospital services because people would actually be in better shape. You are a typically uninformed angry citizen who probably doesn't vote (or are an uninformed voter), is uneducated and speaks about things they have no reason to - bringing up politicians and their fathering/std's is just so stupid. Are you a smoker, drinker, sinner - me thinks so.....

GeezString, if we drive a car, then as a driver, we should all be charged for the pollutants we put into the air that cause people to get sick right? Maybe paying $100 each time we drive a vehicle? Sounds fair, don`t it?

With a name like 'GeezString' I would think that a tax on leg spreading would be sufficient.

Then that would place you in the bankrupt category then, correct ray?

Uh, the smoker who never develops lung cancer won't be seeking treatment for lung cancer in most instances. . .