I was thinking of Terry Schiavo too. Her family kept saying she had awareness and a lot of people just thought it was wishful thinking. Too bad this didn't come before her death. I'm sure they miss her very much.
The case was never really about Terry Schiavo and if she was aware or not. It was a battle for for whether or not the cord should be pulled. Her parents wanted to keep her alive despite her will, and the husband wanted to fulfill his duties as a husband. It had been decided before the accident that if either her or her husband were put into a vegetative state like that that the other would pull the cord on them.
What her parents had WAS wishful thinking. They didn't want their daughter to die, and they let emotions cloud their judgement. They wanted to believe that their daughter wanted to live because they wanted her to live so they continued to make excuses and appeals throughout the ordeal.
The fact that she may have been aware changes nothing. To be aware and vegetative for the rest of your life would be absolute hell in my opinion, and she shared that belief ahead of time and said to kill me if it happens.
Her parents wanted to keep her alive despite her will, and the husband wanted to fulfill his duties as a husband
Her "husband" had been living with another woman for years and had children with her. He was clearly a husband in name only. We do have this thing called "divorce" which makes killing your wife unnecessary.
It had been decided before the accident that if either her or her husband were put into a vegetative state like that that the other would pull the cord on them.
No, it hadn't, and at the time he admitted as much on national television. They were young people who, like the rest of us, rarely if ever talked about such things, or even thought about them. There were certainly no living wills. He often acted as though he hated her. He had her cats put to sleep rather than finding homes for them, he melted her wedding ring down to make jewelry for himself, and was heard calling her "the plant". He denied her parents so much as a lock of her hair upon her death. He is a creep.
Terry Schiavo was not on a vent. What was removed from her was her feeding tube. She was breathing on her own. She, by all intents and purposes, starved to death. Don't misunderstand me, I'm of the opinion that being in a vegetative state would be hell, and I'd much rather be dead if that were me as well. However, the reason there was the big issue with Terry was because it was a feeding tube, and the question became "Is it inhumane to remove feedings from a non-responsive human?".
It is darkly ironic that the whole reason Terry suffered a myocardial infarction was related to her struggle with anorexia nervosa, and due to the loss of O2 to her brain resulted in severe altered neurological functioning....and in the end ultimately died of starvation after her feedings were discontinued.
Please, please, please, if I am a freaking vegetable, just kill me, I don't care if your silly EEG's show I have some residual brainwaves, if I'm a potato, I don't want to be kept alive, please pull the plug, please kill me, please do not be such selfish a$$holes to keep my empty body breathing just to satisfy your shallow needs.
The evil that was done in keeping poor Terry Schaivo alive should be punished 10 fold.
The article also suggested that the new techniques may lead to being able to communicate with such patients. Suppose one of them communicated to yes, please pull the plug. Would they do it? No doubt there would be battalions of right-to-lifers campaigning to make that illegal. And it would certainly put a new spin on the topic of assisted suicide.
Ken, why do you suppose they have a living will? Do you have one on file? If not, why not?
NOBODY knows what Terry Schiavo wanted. Nobody will know what you would have wanted either, unless you take the time to do this. It isn't that big a deal. Some HMOs are insisting that their physicians offer it to every patient.
The article also suggested that the new techniques may lead to being able to communicate with such patients. Suppose one of them communicated to yes, please pull the plug. Would they do it? No doubt there would be battalions of right-to-lifers campaigning to make that illegal.
You don't know that at all. I would assume that any judge would take such things into account. But again, the smart thing to do is to put your wishes down BEFORE you become incapacitated instead of relying on what anybody else may or may not think.
The autopsy on Terri Schiavo proved that she did not have any sort of conscious, intellectually functioning brain at any level. The thinking parts were atrophied; only the brainstem kept her involuntary bodily functions going.
Sadly for Terri's parents, her husband was right: That which was Terri was long gone, and there really was no awareness at any level before he let her go.
The doctor who did the autopsy was a member of the "Hemlock Society". That makes his scientific integrity questionable. Dr. Cyril Wecht asked for the right to participare in the autopsy and was denied.
So what did they think? That your brain is either ON or OFF? If the best I can do is imagine that I'm moving some part of my body, please pull the plug. The resources I'm using up can be better used by the living.
Then if you have not already done so, call either your family attorney or your PCP right NOW and ask about the procedure for a living will. Why put your loved ones through the torture of having to guess what you may have wanted? Stop whining that the law should do for you what you ought to have done for yourself.
Bio-chemical electrical potentials are rudimentary. Even a 'dead battery' will have some measureable ionic activity. A corpse may have some residual activity. The unanswered question is at what point is one a self conscious entity that is generally recognized as human life? Defining criteria may change, but the universal measure would be to ask if this happened 100 years ago or a 1000 years ago, before mechaical ventilation, TPN feeding and other high tech medical interventions, would this body be in a hospital bed or a cemetary? If I were in a similar predicament I would rather have Dr. Kevorkian as my physician rather than Dr. Frankenstein.
How in the world did you get "volunteers" that has persistent vegetative status?
How many people really want to live, glued to a bed... Not able to communicate in a meaningful manner? Blinking is not really communication over the long term... There comes a point in our lives when it is time to let go. To allow nature to do what is correct and timely. I have written my instructions very clearly. I have spoken my instructions to all close to me. There will be no mistake on what I want. How can we justify continuing to bankrupt our planet keeping shells alive...
The healthy volunteers gave them a 'normal' result (IE to verify the machine works on people in general). Problem is, the machine test failed on 25% (3 out of 12) of the healthy functioning brains.
I would think that in the case of a positive result, even if communication isn't feasible, at least they would know to provide stimulation for the patient in the form of music, audio books, and more visititation from family members, instead of just leaving them alone in a bare, quiet room. That would be absolute hell for just about anyone.
My mother had suffered a severe stroke that left her in a vegetative state. Although, there were times while I was holding her hand and she would squeeze it and while I was talking to her she once she did murmur. Not sure what to think but it would be nice to know that in some patients there really is a conscious. I think my mother had one. There was no chance of saving her and I watched her die while I was brushing her hair and telling her how much she was loved. It was not an easy thing to do but my family had chosen what she had wanted. She would not have wanted to live like that. So, we let her go in peace. Sometimes it is the best for the patient. I think it really depends on the condition of the patient and if there is a chance for recovery.
I'm sure Terri Schiavo's family is going to love this article...
I was thinking of Terry Schiavo too. Her family kept saying she had awareness and a lot of people just thought it was wishful thinking. Too bad this didn't come before her death. I'm sure they miss her very much.
So very sad. There is sooo much they still don't know about the human brain and nervous system.
The case was never really about Terry Schiavo and if she was aware or not. It was a battle for for whether or not the cord should be pulled. Her parents wanted to keep her alive despite her will, and the husband wanted to fulfill his duties as a husband. It had been decided before the accident that if either her or her husband were put into a vegetative state like that that the other would pull the cord on them.
What her parents had WAS wishful thinking. They didn't want their daughter to die, and they let emotions cloud their judgement. They wanted to believe that their daughter wanted to live because they wanted her to live so they continued to make excuses and appeals throughout the ordeal.
The fact that she may have been aware changes nothing. To be aware and vegetative for the rest of your life would be absolute hell in my opinion, and she shared that belief ahead of time and said to kill me if it happens.
Her "husband" had been living with another woman for years and had children with her. He was clearly a husband in name only. We do have this thing called "divorce" which makes killing your wife unnecessary.
No, it hadn't, and at the time he admitted as much on national television. They were young people who, like the rest of us, rarely if ever talked about such things, or even thought about them. There were certainly no living wills. He often acted as though he hated her. He had her cats put to sleep rather than finding homes for them, he melted her wedding ring down to make jewelry for himself, and was heard calling her "the plant". He denied her parents so much as a lock of her hair upon her death. He is a creep.
Terry Schiavo was not on a vent. What was removed from her was her feeding tube. She was breathing on her own. She, by all intents and purposes, starved to death. Don't misunderstand me, I'm of the opinion that being in a vegetative state would be hell, and I'd much rather be dead if that were me as well. However, the reason there was the big issue with Terry was because it was a feeding tube, and the question became "Is it inhumane to remove feedings from a non-responsive human?".
It is darkly ironic that the whole reason Terry suffered a myocardial infarction was related to her struggle with anorexia nervosa, and due to the loss of O2 to her brain resulted in severe altered neurological functioning....and in the end ultimately died of starvation after her feedings were discontinued.
Please, please, please, if I am a freaking vegetable, just kill me, I don't care if your silly EEG's show I have some residual brainwaves, if I'm a potato, I don't want to be kept alive, please pull the plug, please kill me, please do not be such selfish a$$holes to keep my empty body breathing just to satisfy your shallow needs.
The evil that was done in keeping poor Terry Schaivo alive should be punished 10 fold.
Ken, I agree.
Notable from article:
25% of fully functioning volunteers did not produce a detectable signal. This means the test is a FAILURE.
I agree 100% and I've told my husband to pull the plug. I would never want to end up like that...
The article also suggested that the new techniques may lead to being able to communicate with such patients. Suppose one of them communicated to yes, please pull the plug. Would they do it? No doubt there would be battalions of right-to-lifers campaigning to make that illegal. And it would certainly put a new spin on the topic of assisted suicide.
Ken, why do you suppose they have a living will? Do you have one on file? If not, why not?
NOBODY knows what Terry Schiavo wanted. Nobody will know what you would have wanted either, unless you take the time to do this. It isn't that big a deal. Some HMOs are insisting that their physicians offer it to every patient.
You don't know that at all. I would assume that any judge would take such things into account. But again, the smart thing to do is to put your wishes down BEFORE you become incapacitated instead of relying on what anybody else may or may not think.
The autopsy on Terri Schiavo proved that she did not have any sort of conscious, intellectually functioning brain at any level. The thinking parts were atrophied; only the brainstem kept her involuntary bodily functions going.
Sadly for Terri's parents, her husband was right: That which was Terri was long gone, and there really was no awareness at any level before he let her go.
The doctor who did the autopsy was a member of the "Hemlock Society". That makes his scientific integrity questionable. Dr. Cyril Wecht asked for the right to participare in the autopsy and was denied.
I read this and thought it said,
Tests find awareness in vegetarian brains.
I know vegetarians can be self-righteous, but I wouldn't have assumed they were brain dead.
So what did they think? That your brain is either ON or OFF? If the best I can do is imagine that I'm moving some part of my body, please pull the plug. The resources I'm using up can be better used by the living.
Then if you have not already done so, call either your family attorney or your PCP right NOW and ask about the procedure for a living will. Why put your loved ones through the torture of having to guess what you may have wanted? Stop whining that the law should do for you what you ought to have done for yourself.
Bio-chemical electrical potentials are rudimentary. Even a 'dead battery' will have some measureable ionic activity. A corpse may have some residual activity. The unanswered question is at what point is one a self conscious entity that is generally recognized as human life? Defining criteria may change, but the universal measure would be to ask if this happened 100 years ago or a 1000 years ago, before mechaical ventilation, TPN feeding and other high tech medical interventions, would this body be in a hospital bed or a cemetary? If I were in a similar predicament I would rather have Dr. Kevorkian as my physician rather than Dr. Frankenstein.
How in the world did you get "volunteers" that has persistent vegetative status?
How many people really want to live, glued to a bed... Not able to communicate in a meaningful manner? Blinking is not really communication over the long term... There comes a point in our lives when it is time to let go. To allow nature to do what is correct and timely. I have written my instructions very clearly. I have spoken my instructions to all close to me. There will be no mistake on what I want. How can we justify continuing to bankrupt our planet keeping shells alive...
The healthy volunteers gave them a 'normal' result (IE to verify the machine works on people in general). Problem is, the machine test failed on 25% (3 out of 12) of the healthy functioning brains.
I would think that in the case of a positive result, even if communication isn't feasible, at least they would know to provide stimulation for the patient in the form of music, audio books, and more visititation from family members, instead of just leaving them alone in a bare, quiet room. That would be absolute hell for just about anyone.
Good point, rkaralius, especially early on when they are not sure whether or not the patient IS is a PVS.
Mmm... vegetative brains... like two meals in one.
My mother had suffered a severe stroke that left her in a vegetative state. Although, there were times while I was holding her hand and she would squeeze it and while I was talking to her she once she did murmur. Not sure what to think but it would be nice to know that in some patients there really is a conscious. I think my mother had one. There was no chance of saving her and I watched her die while I was brushing her hair and telling her how much she was loved. It was not an easy thing to do but my family had chosen what she had wanted. She would not have wanted to live like that. So, we let her go in peace. Sometimes it is the best for the patient. I think it really depends on the condition of the patient and if there is a chance for recovery.